John Shegerian: Get the latest Impact Podcast right into your inbox each week. Subscribe by entering your email address at impactpodcast.com, to make sure you never miss an interview. This edition of the Impact Podcast is brought to you by ERI. ERI has a mission to protect people, the planet and your privacy, and is the largest fully integrated IT and electronics asset disposition provider and cybersecurity focused hardware destruction company in the United States and maybe even the world. For more information on how ERI can help your business properly dispose of outdated electronic hardware devices, please visit eridirect.com. This episode of the Impact podcast is brought to you by Closed Loop Partners. Closed Loop Partners is a leading circular economy investor in the United States with an extensive network of Fortune 500 corporate investors, family offices, institutional investors, industry experts and Impact partners. Closed Loop’s platform spans the arc of capital from Venture Capital to Private Equity, bridging gaps and fostering synergies to scale the circular economy. To find Closed Loop Partners, please go to www.closedlooppartners.com.

John: Welcome to another edition of the impact podcast. I’m John Shegerian, and this is a very, very special edition of the Impact Podcast. We have with us today, Aliia Roza. She’s a former and now, a public speaker. Aliia, it’s just an honor and a joy, and a pleasure to have you with us today.

Aliia Roza: Thank you so much John. I’m really excited, and I’m very grateful, and thank you for having me.

John: You’re one of the most compelling guests that I’ve ever invited on the show in 20 years. I just want to share with our audience and listeners a little bit. You are a Russian-born, Former Intelligence officer who is now turned to be an entrepreneur. A media personality with over a million followers on Instagram, and also a very compelling public speaker with an important message to give. Your recent podcasts, To Die For, has become one of the top podcasts in the world. I’ve listened to it twice, and I’m probably going to listen to it again. It was so interesting, compelling and just really, I was blown away by your life. I want to say thank you for just sharing some time with us today, and thank you for making yourself available. Aliia, where do we start? I think we should start somewhere at the beginning, where you were born and where you grew up?

Aliia: Thank you, John, for this amazing introduction. I honestly, so grateful for being here. Thank you for making a really big impact on people and sharing the knowledge and educating, especially the young generation about a lot of important things in life. Well, starting from the beginning, I was born in USSR, the country which doesn’t exist anymore. My father, at that time, was a very high-ranking officer of the Secret Intelligence Agency. Since I was a little girl, I remember he was training me as a future soldier. So when I turned 18, my path was sort of already in front of me, and I couldn’t really say no, or I want to do something else. I did actually. I said, “Dad, I really want to work in fashion”, and he’s like, “What is fashion? You have one shoes, one skirt, that’s it.” So he brought me to my first department, and after that department, I got enrolled into the special academy. It’s an Internal Affairs Academy in Russia, and I started my education. I didn’t know, of course, that I would be enrolled in a special program such as sexpionage. I didn’t even know about that program, but I would say, whoever will listen to the podcast, To Die For, and learn about this special program, what we’ve been studying, and how we study, like my latest missions, I would say, that made me who I am today. Learning those skills really helps me in my life even like, any day, literally any day, I use my skills.

John: Aliia, let’s go back. It wasn’t just your dad, you were an only child, and also your grandfather was a military hero in Russia.

Aliia: Yeah.

John: So you came from a line of military heroes, your grandpa, your dad. So you were sort of the only child, and maybe really your dad’s hope of continuing that military greatness. So. you sort of almost got treated like his favorite son.

Aliia: Well, he did expect a son, but here I am.

John: So really, this was what he groomed you for, based on your family legacy and history. This was sort of the only path that you were given or the right path by your family.

Aliia: Yes, fortunately or unfortunately, that was the only path, and sometimes, I think people will relate to that. We want to make our parents be proud of us.

John: Of course.

Aliia: Whatever our parents say, we want to be the best in that, and usually we want to follow their profession. So, when my dad started to teach me from a very early age, I remember I was like five, and he already would give me a lot of exercises. He would constantly, every single day, train my brain, program it for success. So for example, I was not allowed to cry. I was not allowed to be emotional. I know it’s sort of like the way the Russian army is. So you have to be strong, cold-blooded, really focus on your mission, and that’s the most important. So I thought like this is the right way and I obviously love my dad, and I wanted to make him proud. I wanted to be a hero of that country as my grandpa. So [crosstalk]

John: He was giving you what he knew, his version of love while he was teaching you in preparing you for how he was probably treated by your grandpa. He was giving you that same education from a very young age to prepare you for your future military career.

Aliia: Absolutely. That’s only one way he saw for me, and yes, of course he loves me, and every parent loves their child. But sometimes because of their situation in life, in that period of time, I think he thought this would be the best way for me. Because of course, coming back, maybe 20 years ago, that time, Putin just became a president after a revolution, which was terrible. I remember, people lived in poverty. There was no food in the shops. People were starving to death, and it was a really difficult time in Russia after the Soviet Union fell apart. So, the only way out was to work in the government and have a high position as you can, as you could. Either you would become sort of a government person, or you would go to the criminal gang. So there will be two paths, that’s it.

John: Well, so when you entered the military for military school or training, how old were you?

Aliia: I was 18 years old.

John: So you were unbelievably a very young woman.

Aliia: Well, I mean, 18 years old in Russia really means that you are already out. You have to be prepared for everything, for anything in life. Russian, I mean, I don’t know what’s happening right now. I haven’t been there for 15 years, but at that time, when I was growing up, being 18, it meant that you were completely an adult, and you had to earn your own money and you had to manage everything yourself. Kids there, my time, they grew up very early so by teenage years, I already made money. I would go and work and earn money. So for me, 18 years old was the time when I understood, “Okay, I’m an adult. I have to take care of myself.”

John: So talk a little bit about that experience on being trained by the military complex, of the Russian military complex. Then how you got pushed into that as you said, not just traditional military, but more military intelligence, which then also was another sub sector in the sexpionage space?

Aliia: Well, when I just got enrolled, I basically started all the skills, which any agent would study like, martial arts and shooting from different types of guns. All the criminal law, administrative law, the history and all that. So, it was just like basic subjects.

John: More than that, a little bit of James Bond stuff too, like offensive and defensive driving, how to break and enter, and all that. It was tough, right?

Aliia: Yes. I learned extreme driving. I learned how to open, for example, doors using the hair clip, the hair pin. We would learn all the devices. How to put bugs? Where to put bugs? How to put bugs maybe in a telephone, in the car, under the table, in the office space or wherever. How to make it work in the right way, so my colleagues would hear it, and maybe record something? We would have these small little buttons, which could be put in your jacket, and it would be the video camera.

John: Wow.

Aliia: That was, of course, 20 years ago, which was really wild. It was super [crosstalk]

John: Yeah. Yeah.

Aliia: Yeah. How to hide special secret information, where to hide it? So, I would hide it, like, we would learn how to hide it underneath your shoes, or underneath the bottom of the bag. Maybe in some other ways. So, a lot of different small things, but I would call it just basic general subjects.

John: Right. Understood. Okay.

Aliia: But then it’s getting interesting because when I got enrolled into this special program, there were about 350 students as much as I could calculate and remember classes and everything. Only five full girls, including me. So we are all five total who are chosen for this special program, which they wouldn’t call sexpionage. It’s like that’s what we call it, but it was just a special program, which has additional subjects. They would tell us, “This is for special missions in the future and you will learn psychology.” So I was like, “Wow, cool. I like psychology, why not?” We couldn’t really say no. That’s interesting, right? Like, instead of just going and peeling potatoes, or doing physical activities and running for a few kilometers, I would instead sit and learn about the psychology of people. That’s cool.

John: Right.

Aliia: Especially they said, “Oh in the beginning we would learn how to scan people. How to read people’s intentions? How to understand who’s lying, who’s not? How to understand the body language of anyone, especially criminals? Because they have absolutely different presents, the way they present themselves. So you can really, even now, I can really understand who is having shady intentions. Shady starts in the heart when I look at the crowd.

John: Wow.

Aliia: So, I can understand who is a drug addict, who’s a drug dealer, who is a robber, who is doing what, who has this, maybe criminal past or something? So, it was interesting in the beginning, of course, but then it was getting more interesting because then we were studying seduction techniques. It’s not just about sexual techniques that we studied, but seduction, I would say, 80% is about art of communication with your target. How to make him like you or her? How to adapt yourself to this person? How to find weak spots? So you know where to push and press whenever it’s needed, whenever it will be the convenient time. How to make this person believe you and trust you completely because everything is based on trust, if your target, which could be an informer, trusts you, he will do everything for you. If your target would fall in love with you, then this man or woman can do whatever it takes, which is also incredible. Also, how to find the benefit for this person and kind of align this potential future, the best future for your target, so the target would believe in and look at this carrot which you just placed in front of him, and go into the direction where you are showing him in a very subtle way. It’s important because no one likes manipulation when it’s direct.

John: Right.

Aliia: When you do it in a really subtle way, and you make the person believe that he is the best version of himself with you only, then it’s even much more, it’s much stronger than any drug in the world.

John: So, this was covert manipulation, not over manipulation.

Aliia: Well, yes, I think. It’s still manipulation, but [crosstalk]

John: [inaudible]right?

Aliia: Yeah.

John: Now, when you were thinking about the 350 people that were chosen, was it a friendly group, where you were friendly among each other, or you really weren’t friendly among each other?

Aliia: No. First of all, we were not allowed to be friends.

John: Oh wow.

Aliia: Like, friends-friends.

John: Right.

Aliia: Of course, we were talking and chatting, and some would hang out and all that, but we were not allowed to have a really strong emotional connection. It’s very important because when you’re emotional, that’s what they taught me in the beginning, and unfortunately I am here now, and I am struggling very much to build an emotional bond with someone. Even though I’m a mother, and I love my son very much, I still have this like when– I will do everything for my son, of course, but I cannot attach myself to anyone. Like, I have a lot of friends, and a lot of admirers, and all that. But yet, I just can not do that. I cannot attach myself to someone. People said, “Oh, I cannot live without you.” I can live without anyone. I’m okay. I know I’m strong, I’ll survive, whatever. I’m okay, and that’s what they teach. So, you cannot have– I mean, like, if I would work there, I wouldn’t be able, and I wouldn’t be allowed to have family because family members, this is your weak spot. If somebody needs something from you, they can kidnap your kids, and you’ll do everything to save your kids, of course, all your beloved man. This is your weakness. So you cannot have any attachments in your life. So that’s why friendship, love and all these amazing things which human beings have, unfortunately, I didn’t have.

John: So you were being trained in disassociated behavior.

Aliia: Right.

John: But when you are assessing the group of 350, yourself, although you couldn’t become friends with them and attach, was the 350 chosen because you were the just the brightest among the general pool of people who entered the military that year that you entered? Is it because of the sheer brain power that all 350 have? When you look back, is that a fair statement, you were chosen for brains?

Aliia: It is, but in addition, I would say, there are special parameters: how did they choose us? Like, they were sort of different examinations. So, it’s not just your intelligence skills and IQ level and all that, but it’s also the ability to react quickly in stressful situations. So there will be certain tests, psychological tests, and according to what we would reply, they would make a summation. Of course, your physical abilities, how quick, how fast can you run? If you need to save the document or information, you need to be able to escape fast. You have to be able to fight back. You have to be physically really strong. As I said, my father started my training at five years old. So, I was a very strong kid. Like, I mean [crosstalk]

John: So no shock that you were picked here, because you were really trained for this moment in time since you were five years old by your dad. This is sort of a natural progression that you rose above everybody else, and were seen by the leadership to be picked for this group because this is where you are really trained for.

Aliia: Yes, and I think, if my father didn’t train me, I don’t think I would pass that path.

John: Right. Interesting.

Aliia: Yeah, and of course, also an important thing, which in this profession has to be very– one of the important parameters is your physical appearance. So, they only could choose ladies, women who are younger than 28 years old. So not after 30s; they had to be single. They have to have at least 5’6″ height. They had to have no more than– I don’t know how many, in pounds. Okay. So, it’s about 100 pounds no more. So you have to be, yeah, tall, basically fit and skinny. It’s almost like choosing the model, but [crosstalk]

John: Right. So, for the women, five women candidates, you were the elite of brains and beauty for those five women candidates?

Aliia: Well, I wouldn’t say though. All these girls were really beautiful, and very smart, and I kind of like, they were really amazing agents. Now, there is also a parameter, which is very important to mention is your love for the country.

John: Wow, okay.

Aliia: There were certain tests where they would ask, “What would you do in this situation? Would you betray your country [crosstalk]

John: Wow, okay.

Aliia: …if you’ll be tortured by American enemies? What would you do, would you give formation? There’ve been sort of program that if something like this happened, and you have an important information, you would be able to kill yourself as well.

John: Wow.

Aliia: So like, terminate yourself.

John: So this was part of your DNA. Wasn’t there at that point, when you were a young woman, wasn’t there a monument of your grandpa’s greatness, a monument of your grandpa?

Aliia: Yeah, even my son went there. My dad even brought my son there, and then my son in England, when we leave there, he stood up in the class and said, “My great-grandfather was a national hero, and he fought during the second war”, and all that stuff. Even he, has this pride. Of course, it’s a big heritage for our family, and totally did affect me a lot. But you know what, I would say, I understood later on, it was not patriotic feeling to the country as to people. So I mentioned that, but I– you know, it’s love for people because I looked a people as my children, if it does make sense. Because I feel that I sort of had that life with that sort of secret advanced skills, which nobody really knows. They don’t really have an opportunity to learn, and I have that, and I understand a lot of things in life and what’s happening, really. So I feel like this is my responsibility to take care of those people who don’t have that opportunity to take care about themselves. I feel that I’m responsible for the future. It’s like you, as a parent, you’re responsible for the future of your kids that’s why you educate them. That’s why you teach them, and all that. So, I feel the same way towards civilians. Sorry to say, but I still feel that.

John: No, yeah.

Aliia: I just don’t know how to express the feeling.

John: How long was that training for?

Aliia: Well, because of my very dangerous mission, I left earlier, but usually it would be 3-4 years depending on your position. But how does it work? You study for six months, then you go to practice. So they usually send you to different missions, and they have to estimate if you are okay to go to the next level. So, basically, this education never stops because it’s always updated with the new gadget.

John: Ahh, they raise the bar every time you come back from another mission.

Aliia: Yes.

John: They raised the bar again and again. Wow, again, and anything, I ask you during the taping of the show that’s inappropriate, you just please stop me and you tell me such because that’s not the purpose. But I assume people would go out on missions out of that. 350 group, and sometimes they never came back.

Aliia: Of course, this is part of your job.

John: Part of the deal.

Aliia: Part of your sacrifice.

John: Right.

Aliia: So, it would be like, it’s an honor to die in a fight.

John: Right. You’re dying for the greater good.

Aliia: Yes.

John: You’re dying for the greater food of [crosstalk]

Aliia: Absolutely.

John: I get it. So okay, the training happens, and now you’re 20-21 when you start doing more missions?

Aliia: Yes. So I started when I was actually 19. I went for the first missions– for the first kind of missions where I just started to learn what it is all about. Then yeah, you’re moving forward with all these missions later on.

John: Again, I listened to your great podcast, and again for our listeners and viewers, it’s To Die For. It’s one of the top podcasts in the world. You can find it on Spotify and Apple, and any other great podcast platform. I urge you to listen to it. I sent it out to at least 50 or 60 of my friends, and they all just were blown away by your story. To find Aliia, you could go to todieforspy.com. This will all be in the show notes, and all of Aliia’s other social media platforms such as Instagram are also will be in the show notes. So we’ll make it very easy to access all of this information. When did the trauma and the abuse, both sexual, otherwise, start happening during this process?

Aliia: Well, literally, on the second weekend, or on the second week when I came to my department, and I explained all this in detail in the podcast because it’s just like, I’m okay now, I’ve been working with many therapists. So I’m okay to speak about it, but it’s just like, really sort of difficult to listen to, I would say, because I was lied to. My colleague called me, called basically to our home, the home number, and that time I didn’t have my cell– obviously it was 20 years ago. So he called my home number, my dad picked up and he said, my colleague said, “Well, we have a murder so she needs to come as soon as possible to the department.” It was about like 8:00 P.M. or something, and my dad was like, “Come on, quickly. It’s an alarm; you have to go.” So I came to the department, and I understood that there was nothing like that. There was no work, and the person who knew my father, and actually was much higher rank than mine, of course, that time he just took advantage, and because of the respect to the people working there, and also he was my sort of boss, right? I couldn’t disobey, and I just froze, and I tried to negotiate. I was like, “Well, I cannot do it because I’m a virgin. I cannot do this because I have my period. I cannot do this because my Dad will notice something. I just cannot do it.”

John: Right.

Aliia: It didn’t work, of course, and it was my big trauma, and I didn’t know it was a trauma. So I kind of hid everything inside of me. I didn’t tell anyone, and it was just abuse, after abuse, after abuse, and I just went into this trap of sexual abuse without even understanding what’s going on. Then I understood that, “Oh, well, every woman who worked there, they have the same situation. So, that’s why women would never have their private lives especially if you are an agent and you work in the field. None of them would have husbands or boyfriends, and no kids. So everybody would have this situation where they had to sleep with different colleagues, or bosses, or wherever. So, I thought, maybe this is how it’s supposed to be, I guess. Like, this is the way.” So, yes.

John: Yeah. So the trauma started early, and again, we’re using the word trauma now; 20 years or so later trauma wasn’t part of our vernacular. Mental health and wellness wasn’t even part of our vernacular 20, 25 years ago. It just wasn’t openly talked about like we’re talking about it today. So how would you, as a 19 or 20 year-old know? People much older didn’t talk about it back then, frankly speaking.

Aliia: Yes. To be honest, I think in Russia, they still don’t have anything like that.

John: Right. You’re right, but even in more evolve societies, as we’ve discussed, other societies
as well, don’t talk about it as well. So it’s not just Russia.

Aliia: Yeah. I think in those countries like Russia or Cuba, Malaysia, or I don’t know about Malaysia, but I think in Saudi Arabia, and countries and all that, they just don’t have the culture of the wellness and healthy mindset, unfortunately. I think kids have to be taught, I mean, have to learn that in school that they have to take care about their mental health, and this is very important.

John: So this trauma started inside with your superiors and colleagues while you were also being trained to go out and do your special missions.

Aliia: Yes. So, it was actually as my boss that time, the colonel, he said, “This is part of the education.” So, every single female agent had to go through that, and even worse. I’m talking about really big abuse like orgies, and even some fetish, crazy things, which, thank God, I didn’t do because I, coming to the– I don’t want to spoil the podcast whoever will listen to it, if they didn’t yet. But I kind of, when I understood that I tried to organize my life there in a way where the colonel could protect me in a way. So even though he was the abuser and the manipulator, I still made him to protect me.

John: Well, let’s just look at it from, I’m in a corporate setting, and I’m the CEO of a corporation. This was, from the hierarchical stand point, you were using your intelligence to figure out, “Well, wait a second, if I ingratiate myself to the leader of this hierarchy, I can then maybe be safe by even engaging in this behavior that seems a little bit off-base.” But you were learning that as part of this military or paramilitary organization was sort of normalized among your peers.

Aliia: Yeah, absolutely. I didn’t really have the– I don’t know, did I have any other option? I don’t know, but that time I was just 18 years old, and I didn’t really know anything about relationship and [crosstalk]

John: You’re doing the best with what you had at that time.

Aliia: Right. I just didn’t want to sleep with all these men.

John: Yeah. Yeah.

Aliia: [inaudible] like, “I cannot do that.”

John: Right.

Aliia: I just like to save myself as much as I can.

John: Did you and the other– I mean, again, did you and the others– that was you and four other women, did you compare notes or not really? You just learned what was going on with them, but you didn’t compare notes.

Aliia: We didn’t compare notes.

John: Did you talk to each other about it, “This is what happened to me? What happened to you, or no?

Aliia: Yeah, absolutely…

John: Okay.

Aliia: … and knowing them having orgies.

John: Wow.

Aliia: That if I wouldn’t protect myself, then the next girl would be me, and I didn’t want to do that because it’s like, it was out of my understanding.

John: Right. So talk a little bit about– okay, so now, you’re involved with the leader of the organization, the top guy. Where did this evolve to in terms of your missions and how did that go?

Aliia: Well, in the beginning, he really did protect me from all this crazy stuff there, and he even went further. But you see, the point is that, those techniques, and I don’t know, John, it’s just like every single time I communicate with people, female or male, in the normal life, it’s just like coming out for me in a very automatic way, but I would say, “We do like people because we look at someone and we feel good about someone, or we like the way this person presents himself. But if you know a little bit about these psychological techniques, and you behave in that certain way, you can make anyone really like you. If you need them to fell in love with you, if it’s different, I mean, like if it’s all targets [crosstalk]

John: Yeah, super power, you had a secret super power.

Aliia: Well, I think everybody can learn any super powers, if they really want to. We all can learn and craft our skills.

John: But as you said, he was a higher– he was more a seasoned professional, the gentleman was, your boss. So, I assume he was a master at these superpowers. So he was using them on you as well.

Aliia: Of course, yes, and that’s how it was. It was like a game, but [crosstalk]

John: Did you fall in love with him?

Aliia: Oh, no, I did not.

John: Okay. So, it didn’t work on you because you also knew, you were already being trained on this information yourself. So you knew how to disassociate from that.

Aliia: You know, John, it’s one Russian statement, very important which I always keep in mind. “Never attack straight away because revenge is a cold dish.” So meaning, that you will always have a chance for revenge.

John: Wow.

Aliia: Okay? Just wait and analyze, and sometimes it’s better to see and just sit down and wait rather than just attack and make a fight.

John: Got it. Impressive. Brilliant.

Aliia: Even though I was really angry, and that’s what my dad actually told me, to be super cold blooded. So, yeah, of course, I was angry and all that, but I wanted to win, and I wanted to succeed.

John: How did you evolve professionally in terms of your missions, and how did you become, for lack of better terms, one of the chosen red sparrows of Russia, or one of the chosen? What was that division called, by the way? What would be an analogous? For our listeners and viewers, Aliia, what would that division call? Is that a CIA? Is it a different version of that? What would that be called in America or some other country?

Aliia: Okay. So it would be called sort of D-A-E, right? The drug enforcement.

John: Okay.

Aliia: That’s the department I used to work at, but it was under the FSB, which was previously known as KGB, okay? That department, particularly, was fighting against human and drug trafficking.

John: So that’s where your whole division was. It was human and drug trafficking that you were being put in-charge of helping regulate.

Aliia: Yeah. So mostly all of my missions have been under that department, and most of my time I spent there. Yes.

John: Understood. So, talk a little bit about your missions. What did your missions look like, and what was the purpose of your missions, and how did you keep moving up the ladder there?

Aliia: Okay. I didn’t really keep moving the ladder, but when I was 18, I was super– I just romanticized the profession because I felt that I will help these people, especially, after, as I’ve said, after perestroika, the USSR fall, there were so many homeless kids. Small kids just starving to death on the streets. It was terrible to see, so that affected me so much. So I wanted to do impact, and we didn’t– I mean, working there, you don’t really make a lot of money. It’s just that it was a very standard salary. If I would translate that Russian ruble to US dollar, I would have $100 a month working six days a week.

John: Wow.

Aliia: Of course, it was 20 years ago, but still I don’t know how much money they make right now, but I think not more than $1,000 a month, for sure. But you see, the point is that you don’t do it because of money, and money it’s not your dream tool. You’re doing this for a much bigger impact, which you can do to the world. That’s what I wanted to do for people. When you go to the mission with this purpose, to help someone because you are stronger, because you are more advanced, in a way because of the superpowers you have, because the government invested in your superpowers, in your skills. You have the team, our military who is going with you, you feel like a real superhero. I felt like a superhero at that time. I felt like I had a gun. I have a team. I have this intelligent organization behind me. So, I felt like I can change the world, really. When I saw all these bad guys, that time I didn’t understand that these bad guys, they’re much stronger, much clever, much powerful, much experience, I didn’t understand that I thought like, I will succeed. I will terminate my target, or make my target to do what I will tell them to do. I guess that’s also one of the brainwashing programming techniques, which as an agent we used to get in order to complete our missions. So, if you– I forgot the name– oh my God, I’m so sorry. But it’s very important to have in your mind the vision of your success before getting there. So [crosstalk]

John: Visualization.

Aliia: Win the war before the first fight. It’s very important. If you have any doubts that something might go wrong, you’ll fail. This is very important in any situation in life. In business, negotiations, anywhere. If you go to a job interview and you feel like you don’t deserve it, obviously you will fail. That’s the whole thing.

John: So you went into every mission, you were trained to go into every mission visualizing success.

Aliia: Only. Like, even if I have fears right now, like you’re in public speaking, and public speaking is number one fear. That fear is in second place. I was thinking, sometimes when I go to the city I’m like, “Huh.” I have these butterflies in my belly, and I’m like, “Wait, girl. Come on. You’ve done it so many times. You know how to do it.” I just like, you know what,
when you allow these negative thoughts to come to your mind and create this negative virtual reality, it doesn’t exist.

John: That’s right.

Aliia: Okay? But you put yourself into virtual reality and you start to experience, your brain starts to send all these impulses to your body, and you start to experience anxiety and fear, and negative emotions. You don’t need that. What is, instead, you will imagine yourself to be the best version right now, and make it happen.

John: Right.

Aliia: So that’s one of the best techniques, is anchoring for this sort of occasion. If you feel like you are anxious, or you feel uncomfortable, you have to do technique 333. Basically, when before missions, if I would feel like I’m scared, then you need to bring– what happens your brain goes to this kind of negative virtual reality, which is like it doesn’t exist yet. To bring your brain back to reality, you have to see and notice three things around you. Like, I don’t know, car, door, table, whatever. Three things you hear, like birds singing, the car driving or somebody talking on the phone, and three things you feel. It could be the fabric you touched from your jacket, or a table surface or whatever, anything else. So you put your brain back to reality so you feel more stable. This is very important when you need to quickly come back to you, and be in this reality instead, like, “Everything is okay. Everything is safe. Even the war happens, but I’m still alive. I need to do it. So, I must do it. ” You go ahead and you do it.

John: These are real science-backed techniques. My therapist has told me the same techniques, and I think these are very universal, but most people don’t learn them unless they work with a professional. So, I think that’s fascinating. It’s fascinating.

Aliia: We did it. It says like, the KGB program is all based on psychology.

John: Right.

Aliia: Psychology and anchoring. The second technique, which is also very powerful, and I always give to my student especially when they’re anxious, about meeting new people, or get the job, for example. So you must remember yourself in the situation where you were the winner, where you remember yourself being the best. For example, John, when was your perfect day when you found yourself the best version of yourself, maybe you sense or feel or something. Do you remember that moment?

John: Sure.

Aliia: Can you close your eyes, please?

John: Yeah, sure.

Aliia: Remember that moment, remember what feeling you had?

John: Very good feeling. A very positive feeling about myself.

Aliia: Amazing. So now, you should tell your brain one word, choose one word, and tell it to your brain. It can be [inaudible] and at the same time, please pinch your finger or anything. Just find any spot on your body, which you touch.

John: Okay. Do it. I’m doing it.

Aliia: Okay, perfect. Open your eyes and remember this, and every time you will go to, I don’t know, any of your future missions, you pinch yourself at the same spot with the same finger, and you tell your brain the same word. You can say it out loud or like [crosstalk] it tells your brain. Instantly our brain will remember. So this is an anchor, which you placed, and instantly, our brain will remember that. So, those memories from where you felt the best version of yourself, and it will recreate that condition. You will feel much more stable because you’re like, “Well, wait a minute, if I did that time, great, so I can do it again, because I’ve done it.” Do you remember? You did it already, John. So, we are good.

John: Right.

Aliia: So, that’s the game.

John: Right.

Aliia: That’s how our brain works.

John: Wow. So, you would go out on these missions and you’ll be given a target. The target could be a male or a female.

Aliia: Yes.

John: Because your skillset works with either– it’s sexually agnostic, let’s just say.

Aliia: Everybody will be, “Oh my God, she sleeps with women too?”

John: That’s not the important part of this discussion, but wait a second. So, just a little bit of survival skills; when you’re forced to do things you don’t want to do by the gentleman who was running your division who was taking advantage of you, was that when you leaned into your disassociation skills? So during those times you’ve disassociated from that, so you were able to put that in a part of your brain, and disassociate from it and function, normally, otherwise?

Aliia: The first important rule for any agents that they need to learn is to be able to live a double life. This is very important. So disassociating yourself, your body from your emotions is number one. Again, they would say, “No emotions. Emotions always destroy every single mission.” All this cold-blooded.

John: Got it.

Aliia: Second; be able to live a double life, which means that you can be whoever you want. It’s like acting basically.

John: Right.

Aliia: The funny thing is when I did some acting classes just for fun, the coaches would say, “Oh my God, you’re such a good actress. How long did you do it?” I’m like, “I had in high school, the KTV program.” So anyway, coming to the point, you have to be able to live a double life where you can be a father and a great husband, and a son, and friend, and business partner. Then at the same time you have your dark shadow where in the night, you go with the gun somewhere who doesn’t [inaudible] and you save the world. It’s like Batman.

John: I like it. You’re James Bond, Batman. Is Hollywood, before we get into your life chasing the targets, was it so much of– was this Hollywood get it right, or is it really, are they all face when we watch Red Sparrow, when we watch Black Widow, when we watch Salt, is it just an over glamorization of really what was going on?

Aliia: Okay, from the oldest three movies, personally I like Salt, because it was closer to reality. Then the second place I would put Red Sparrow because of their understanding of the idea of having these schools in Russia. Because people think that this is all made up, which is so funny because nobody is questioning Geisha School in Japan. Why do you question Russia, do they have this school or not? I do believe that these schools are established everywhere in the world, not just in Russia.

John: Right.

Aliia: The third movie is the Black Widow because Black Widow is completely fictionalized. But I do like the story in the beginning. Her story, Natasha Romanoff, the story of that, the way that she was raised, it’s very similar to what basically girls are experiencing when they are raised in that circumstance. Yes.

John: What you just said is so important. I don’t want to gloss over that. It’s really unfair for the media to impress upon us, here in this country or media in any country to demonize Russia because that’s what’s been highlighted in Hollywood with the Red Sparrow and other things. The truth is what you just said is probably closer to reality. Every country is engaging in some version of this kind of behavior whether it’s called sexpionage, whether it’s called whatever version it is, but this exists all around the world.

Aliia: It does, but at the end of the day, I would say, I know a lot of stories and I do believe American agencies also have where– and I think, like, James Bond, that’s why it’s so popular, and for so many years, people just love this movie and love watching it because at the end of the day, it is really true. Agents, undercover really save our world without us civilians knowing it.

John: Right.

Aliia: Because honestly getting the information about the future nuclear bomb, or any other viruses really saves a lot of lives.

John: Understood.

Aliia: They do risk their lives, not for money, and not for fame because they will never have that.

John: Right.

Aliia: Because they cannot live in another way. It’s just in your DNA, like, you’re responsible for people’s health and future and peace. That’s it.

John: Understood. So now, you were given targets, both men and women. Explain how that would work, and then how you went about without giving away too much for the podcast. We want people to listen to the podcast. Again, the podcast is To Die For. It’s one of the top podcasts in the world. It was dropped earlier this year. I’ve listened to it twice, and it was hosted by Neil Strauss, who first wrote this bestseller years ago, The Game. Neil Strauss does a very, not only amazing and thorough job with this podcast, but also is very sensitive to so many of the issues that were around traumas and mental health, and wellness, and recovery, and healing. It’s just amazing. I thought he did an amazing job, and I’m sure that was a fascinating process. We’ll get into the process in a little while. Talk a little bit about the process of targets, and how you went about succeeding in those missions?

Aliia: I would love that, and I just love missions, but for your audience, for people to understand it in an easier way, I would translate those missions into business.

John: Okay.

Aliia: For example, you have a target. A new job in your dream company. All right? So what do you need to do, really, as a spy? What the spy would do in this situation, right?

John: Right.

Aliia: So number one: have as much information as you can about that company; people who work there. Of course, you can do research, and you can Google and blah, blah blah, but you need information about personal qualities of those people who work there. You don’t know what’s the atmosphere there, right? So you would like to learn. So what do you do? You need to find and recruit informer. Okay, so how do you find informer? So you target this informer. You can target this informer maybe in the restaurant during the lunch break, or maybe in a special events like, corporate events, conferences, Wherever. So you target this potential future informer. Second step, the third step, actually; you need to make the informer to like you, and not just using mirroring and copying, and persuasion techniques. But the most important thing is that you need to find out what your informers’ dreams are. What’s his goals? What are his needs?

John: Right.

Aliia: Then, you need to find out how you can give these needs to him. How can you be helpful? Because it has to be mutual, otherwise the informer will not give you information.

John: Right.

Aliia: Okay? So the next step is getting closer to the informer and building an emotional bond, which means emotional bond from the informer, not from you. Otherwise, you will be trapped in this emotional relationship.

John: Wow.

Aliia: So, you do the opposite. So, in their way you include sex. You can include, of course, you start from friendship, number one. You never go with the sex straight away because this ruins everything. I always tell my students, the females, “If you want to build an emotional bond which means a serious relationship, you should not sleep with the man on the first date.” They asked, “What date, third date?” It’s not about how many dates; it’s about building emotional bonds, and that’s important. It’s not only in a romantic relationship, but in business too. So if you’re kind of like, becoming friends, sort of, then it’s easier for you to ask something, like, to ask a favor. All right? But if you go ahead and you start doing that, then, this will be so direct and manipulative. So the person would just back off because it’s too much. Okay? So you don’t want to do that either.

John: Right.

Aliia: So you build an emotional bond, so you become friends. Then you add sex, if it’s needed. It depends on your mission, and it depends on your target. Then after, the next step is when everything is sort of fixed, and you see that your informer is loyal, and trust you, you can do some tests to see, does this informer trust you? Is he sort of yours? When you understand that he is, or she is, then you can give tasks. So for example, “Go to this company and drop my name that I’m the professional expert in this industry, and da, da, da.” That you have, like, a friend of your friend who knows me.” Just to put the seeds into the soil of the company. So raise, or promote me, or maybe invite me to a corporate event where you can introduce me. So it is exactly how the spy would do in that certain mission. Like, connections, introductions, information, and then the spy– I mean, which is you, basically, take over using this information, which you already have after analyzation of the whole thing, of the whole situation. Then you go further and hit the target. That’s all.

John: This edition of the impact podcast is brought to you by Engage. Engage is a digital booking platform revolutionizing the talent booking industry. With thousands of athletes, celebrities, entrepreneurs and business leaders, Engage is the go-to spot for booking talent for speeches, custom experiences, live streams, and much more. For more information on Engage or to book talent today, visit letsengage.com This edition of the impact podcast is brought to you by ERI. ERI has a mission to protect people, the planet and your privacy, and is the largest fully integrated IT and electronics asset disposition provider and cybersecurity focused hardware destruction company in the United States, and maybe even the world. For more information on how ERI can help your business properly dispose of outdated electronic hardware devices, please visit eridirect.com.