Archives: Episodes

John Shegerian: Welcome to another edition of Green Is Good, and we are so honored to have with us today Phil Lisotta. He is the Senior Director of Architecture of Qualcomm. Welcome to Green Is Good, Phil. Phil Lisotta: Thank you very much. Nice to be here, John. John Shegerian: Great to have you today, and you represent one of the great brands in the entire planet – Qualcomm – but before we get talking about all the great work you’re doing at Qualcomm, I want you to share with our listeners first, Phil, your journey, your story leading up to joining Qualcomm and then how has it been since you’ve been there. Phil Lisotta: I think it – my journey if you will – started back when I was in college at Carnegie-Mellon University in Pittsburgh. Everything starting there is focused on the environment and sustainability, building correctly. After college, having worked at multiple different architecture firms, I ended up here in San Diego and worked for an architecture firm that had Qualcomm as a client and I designed one of their first LEED Gold buildings. Then I came on board and started working here about – what was it – eight years ago now. John Shegerian: Eight years ago. Before that was green architecture something – when you were in college was green architecture already being discussed and that was something on your mind, or has that been a recent phenomenon evolution in the last 10, 15 years? Phil Lisotta: No. I think – it might not have been called “green architecture” at the time, right? John Shegerian: Right. Phil Lisotta: I mean, that was back in the 1990s. John Shegerian: Right. Phil Lisotta: But it was always a focus, right? I mean energy, sustainability, building your building in a way that is responsive to the Earth – I think – has always been a tenant of Carnegie-Mellon’s design program. Then, it has just been continuing throughout my career. I think it’s finally getting to the point where pretty much every single architect in the world is paying attention to this now. John Shegerian: So you joined Qualcomm about eight years ago. You are the Senior Director or Architecture for Qualcomm. What does that mean? What does “Senior Director of Architecture for Qualcomm” mean? And share a day in the life and a year in the life of what you’re doing right now. Phil Lisotta: You know, I ask myself often, what does that mean because my role is really very wide here at Qualcomm. In-house, we have a significant team that supports our design process. It starts with space planning, strategic planning, looking at what we call the “butts in seats.” How do we organize those people? Then it leads to the design side of things of how do we design the space? How do we pick the seats that those butts go into? Then looking at the mechanical systems, electrical systems, working with the facility’s maintenance team to make sure that we’re picking the right equipment. Then it goes into the construction management aspect as well. I have a fairly robust team that really focused on are we building this the way we really want to build it? So it’s a very wide organization, and most companies really don’t have that type of breadth, and I’m grateful to have a team that has that technology. John Shegerian: How big is a team like yours? Phil Lisotta: Over 30 people. Closer to 40. John Shegerian: Wow. Phil Lisotta: Yeah, it’s actually, really, a small multi-discipline architecture firm. John Shegerian: Right. Phil Lisotta: And it’s global too. We’re focusing on projects all around the world. It’s not just here in San Diego, where our headquarters is, but all of our locations around the world. John Shegerian: Right. And sustainability. We’re so appreciative you’ve come on the show today. As you evolved as an architect, when did all the facets that you’re talking about whether it’s the chairs that people are sitting in or the water that they’re drinking, the quality of the air that they’re breathing in the buildings that you build – when did the whole 360 start filling in for you? Was it during your time in college, or was it some sort of epiphany, or people you met along the way that further sparked your interest in this, Phil? Phil Lisotta: Well, I think one of the jobs that I had after college – I worked for an architecture firm and then I left that firm and I went to look for a landscape architecture firm. I worked there for about three years, and they really wanted me for my project management aspect, but I remember going in there the first day going, “What am I doing? I know nothing about shrubs and trees?” and I was a little concerned. But having worked there I really realized that the environment is connected to the buildings that we design and that outside-inside sort of dichotomy is super important. I think that’s really where it started for me. But once the USGBC really started pushing the LEED program – I think – is when I realized that it was a much more multifaceted design solution. I had the great opportunity to do Qualcomm’s first LEED Gold building here when I was working for an architecture firm here in San Diego and that’s – I think – sort of where Qualcomm – it started before I got here that they were focused on this as an important part of the facility’s business. John Shegerian: Talk a little bit about the Pacific Center. I know I’m interrupting you. Phil Lisotta: Don’t worry. John Shegerian: The Pacific Center. Was that the first building you worked on or when? Phil Lisotta: No. John Shegerian: When was the Pacific – OK. Phil Lisotta: No, actually, the Pacific Center is our latest building that we’ve done. We have multiple LEED facilities and we have a lot of other facilities that we just didn’t do the LEED certification on, but we feel that they meet or exceed most of the LEED certifications. But the latest project at the Pacific Center – we call it “Pacific Center” because it is actually on Pacific Center Boulevard here in San Diego – that project is over 380,000 square feet of our newest location, which we really started about three years ago. We started it with our employees, saying, “What do you want in your new building?” We sent out a survey and connection to nature, natural ventilation and light were the three biggest things that our employees really wanted. John Shegerian: So you really started it from the ground up. You were listening to your constituents – so to speak – which are your coworkers and employees, and wanting to know what they wanted for their workspace. But workspace is really a misnomer nowadays because it’s really a living space. They’re living there so much of their lives you wanted to hear from them how to create the best environment for them to be working, living during the day. Phil Lisotta: Absolutely. John Shegerian: That’s so cool. Phil Lisotta: And we realized being here in San Diego that being in a building is also being outside of the building. We have such wonderful weather that capturing that was a big tenet of one of the things that we were trying to do. John Shegerian: That is so interesting. For our listeners who just joined us, we’re so excited and honored to have Phil Lisotta. He is the Senior Director of Architecture of Qualcomm. To learn more about Qualcomm and all the great things they’re doing in sustainability, go to www.Qualcomm.com. Phil, talk a little bit about you got the feedback from your colleagues of what they wanted. Talk a little bit about, then, the process of planning and then building this – this is a Gold or is this a Platinum LEED certified building? Phil Lisotta: It’s Gold, actually. It’s Gold. John Shegerian: Got it. So talk a little bit about building then, planning and building this building. Phil Lisotta: Sure. So we worked with multiple design team members, right. John Shegerian: Sure. Phil Lisotta: Where we hired architects and engineers. We have a lot of that staff on in-house as well so we really worked together to guide us to a solution that we feel really excels. The natural light and additionally water use, especially here in California. John Shegerian: Yeah. Phil Lisotta: Was extremely important to us. So we had a bunch of bullet points on the wall, and we kept going back to that during the design process to make sure that we were meeting or exceeding those goals, and we were very successful in doing that. I think this was really the first project that we took a holistic approach and really looked at how that connection to nature and the sustainability was going to hold out. It was really important for us. I think if we hadn’t gone back and forth during the design process to make sure we were meeting that I think we would have missed some things. But we were able to do it, we were able to do it on budget and on schedule, and the employees that have moved in there this past January are pleased as punch so. John Shegerian: Phil, what does the process take? For a layman like me. You did the survey. Now you have the facts and the figures. You have the big data in front of you, and now you’re sitting with your fellow architects and it’s time to plan and build. From the time you got that data to this January, when your colleagues were moving in, how long was that whole cycle? Phil Lisotta: It was about three years in the making and it really started with multiple master plans. We tried lots of different options like “what is the best way to use this site?” The existing site had three buildings on it to begin with and a parking garage and lots of parking lots and we said, “We really want to change this to a more pedestrian space.” So that sort of pre-prototyping – if you will – John Shegerian: Yeah. Phil Lisotta: Of different master plans took us quite a few months just to do that. That was even before we actually designed a building. It was like “how does the site really react to that?” John Shegerian: Wow. Phil Lisotta: Then it gets developed further and further and further, and you would keep narrowing down our solutions to where we feel that we came up with a great architectural design of the buildings as well. John Shegerian: And for our listeners out there to learn more about what Qualcomm does in sustainability it’s – when you’re on your website, which I am right now – sustainability is part of your culture and DNA. It’s very obvious at Qualcomm. Can you share with our listeners what does that translate to in terms of the practices that are implemented across the offices that you build for them? Phil Lisotta: Well, I mean, I think we look at the environment – at least on the facilities side – is it super multifaceted? There are ways to look at what kind of retrofits and improvements that we can do to minimize our energy usage, our water usage, what kinds of designs can we do in our data centers to reduce that energy use, and it goes all the way to providing electric vehicle charging stations for our employees. We’ve actually won – for almost 10 years in a row – awards from the City of San Diego and the county for recycling programs that we’ve provided here at the company. So it’s really from everywhere. We look at it on all ends to the point where we got rid of water bottles in our refrigerators and we provided everybody a reusable water bottle. So every little bit helps and I think utilizing all of our employees’ ideas and ways to save and ways to minimize our impact is huge. And I think our design lately has been looking at more natural daylight for everyone, better ergonomics at their work station, better ways to minimize their energy usage in the labs where a lot of our work is being developed and providing options for people in different ways that they work. I mean, the whole millennial discussion – we could spend an hour on that alone, right? John Shegerian: Exactly. When you said they’re “pleased as punch,” that really struck me, and I’m sure our listeners, because you really listened to them so they should be – in theory – pleased as punch if you built what they were asking for and it all turned out to be that integrative. Their comments and their wishes turned out to be a building that really exemplified what they were looking for and that is fascinating to me. That’s fascinating. Phil Lisotta: It’s interesting, though. Even though I say “pleased as punch,” you can’t please all of the people all of the time, right? So- John Shegerian: Of course. Phil Lisotta: And there are always views about the guys that do have a little bit of a problem with the design. They’re the loudest, right? John Shegerian: They’re the loudest. Phil Lisotta: Yeah. But I think, honestly, way more than 80 percent of the people have – based on occupancy surveys that we’ve done – have said that they really prefer their new workspace over their old workspaces, and I really think that natural light and natural ventilation are the two biggest impacts to that survey. John Shegerian: The silent majority is pleased as punch, and that is good enough for all of us. I love it. Phil Lisotta: Yeah. John Shegerian: So let’s talk about three things. Air quality. So you say there is indoor-out – explain the ventilation thing, and how do you get the best air quality, which everyone is thinking about nowadays? How do you get to ensure the best air quality for your colleagues inside the office space? Phil Lisotta: Sure. So, like I mentioned, San Diego is a wonderful place to be. Our weather is just perfect. And, even more strangely, this building’s location makes it even more ideal. So it is just far enough away from the coast to not be too moist, but it’s inland just enough to get some warmer air. John Shegerian: Right. Phil Lisotta: So we have a weather station on the building – actually, we have multiple – and it’s constantly looking at the current conditions both air quality, if there are particulates in the air, humidity, temperature, wind and direction. And if those sensors all align and the weather conditions are good, the air conditioning will enable the employee to go over and push a button which opens up the windows, turns off the air conditioning, turns onto strictly evacuation mode and allows that to bring that fresh air into the building. John Shegerian: Whoa. Phil Lisotta: If the climate conditions change, the windows will automatically close and go back to the air conditioning mode. John Shegerian: Wow. I love it. That is really cool. Another important topic that of course we are the nation that the world is talking about now but you’re living in a hotbed of it down in – we’re all living in a hotbed in California but even on a micro discussion you’re getting a lot of publicity in San Diego with the big desalinization plant that is going in. Water. How do you ensure water conservation in the buildings, in the structures that you manage and also build and retrofit? Phil Lisotta: Sure. And in all of our newer buildings we’re definitely using better than the standard low-flow fixtures. John Shegerian: Right. Phil Lisotta: I mean, a no-brainer. But a lot of the stuff that we’ve done on the Pacific Center site is looking at water in a different way. The City of San Diego really requires us to minimize our water being put down in the drain – if you will. John Shegerian: Right. Phil Lisotta: So we have a lot of bio swells, a lot of biophilia stuff going on on the site to minimize our water being treated or needing to be treated. Capturing a lot of the water on the site – if you will – to feed the plantings and by specifying the correct plants in the first place so that you don’t have to overwater. But even in all of our other buildings we’re making retrofits to all of our toilets and our sinks and showers and that’s a significant impact. But even more so utilizing the city’s reclaimed water system has been a huge benefit to us. So instead of using potable water in our air conditioning systems and our chiller plants, we’re utilizing the reclaimed water that the city provides and minimizing that potable water use in those areas. John Shegerian: So you’re speaking of like the recycled grey water and things of that such? Phil Lisotta: Yes. Exactly. John Shegerian: Got it. Phil Lisotta: I think that’s the majority of our water usage in our buildings is through our air conditioning and our chiller, and by minimizing that – the potable use – to instead use the reclaimed, it’s a big savings. John Shegerian: You know, Phil, you mentioned a very hot topic a couple minutes ago, and you said we could spend an hour on it and I’m sure we could. We’re down to the last two minutes. Talk a little bit – though, in a truncated fashion – of the millennial opportunity. With you building these beautiful buildings and listening both to the natural environment in San Diego but then to the constituents and colleagues that you have at Qualcomm, does that make recruiting better and easier for your HR department of the millennial generation because you’re building such great and wonderful and sustainable properties? And does that also then further drive home – in a physical sense for a technology company – that you’re so progressive and forward-thinking in terms of sustainability and is a place that those Millennials should be working at? Phil Lisotta: I don’t have any hard data on that, but I can tell you the year before – well, actually, the year that we started designing the building- John Shegerian: Yeah. Phil Lisotta: Some of the vice presidents of the organization that was going to go in to the new building said, “We lost interns that left a few weeks early because they really didn’t feel connected to their co-workers.” John Shegerian: Yeah. Phil Lisotta: And I took that hard and I said, “We need to change the way we’re designing our space so that they can remain engaged with their co-workers and their bosses and their employees,” right? John Shegerian: Right. Phil Lisotta: And since then, the design – I think – has evolved and we’ve paid attention to how the millennial generation works differently than all the other generations. I think that we’re doing a better job of it but honestly I don’t really have any data specifically saying that “hey we’ve recruited the best guy because he said he saw the building.” John Shegerian: Right. Phil Lisotta: But I think it’s very positive, and I’d go out to the buildings a lot and I talk to employees and I try to understand what is working and what is not working for them and I see the younger they are – I hate to do this because it says that I’m old but – the younger they are the more likely they are working in weird places. I mean, they work anywhere, right? They’re connected through their wireless device, which, thankfully, Qualcomm helps enable. But I would never think to go work on the couch that’s a lounge chair that’s off on a balcony, right? But they have no concerns taking their laptop and going there and working there for the day. John Shegerian: Well, Phil, thank you so much for spending time with us today. Phil Lisotta, the Senior Director of Architecture from Qualcomm. To learn more about what Qualcomm is doing in sustainability go to www.Qualcomm.com. Phil, I wish I could work out of one of the buildings you designed and built. And thank you for being living proof that Green Is Good.

John Shegerian: Welcome to another edition of Green Is Good. This is the Green Sports Alliance edition of Green Is Good in beautiful downtown Chicago, and we’re so honored to have with us today Dr. Kimberly Erusha. She is the Managing Director of the USGA – that is the United States Golf Association. Welcome to Green Is Good. Kimberly Erusha: Thank you. I appreciate the opportunity. John Shegerian: Now, before we get talking about one of the greenest sports ever – golf – and the USGA and all the great work you’re doing there, I’d like you to please share a little bit about your journey, your story. How did you become the managing director of the USGA, and what did your sustainability journey look like growing up and things of that such? Kimberly Erusha: Well, it’s an interesting way you get involved in a sport, and you never know how that journey is going to take you, there is no doubt about that. John Shegerian: Right. Kimberly Erusha: I remember I was a horticulture major in college, and people always say, “Well, how did you get into horticulture?” It was one of those where every year my mom always bought me one of these punch-and-grow kits, where you used to punch the holes in the top of the plastic and then you’d plant your seeds in the little containers and let them grow and then put them into the garden, so that was always my introduction into horticulture, which got me interested in it. John Shegerian: Wow. Kimberly Erusha: And in college, it was one of those where my advisor was in turf grass management and the jobs just naturally evolved that way, which eventually led me to the USGA. John Shegerian: How many years ago did you join the USGA? Kimberly Erusha: It will be 25 years at the end of this year so I’ve been with them awhile. John Shegerian: You’ve been with them awhile. So when you joined the USGA, what was the role you had then and how did that evolve? Kimberly Erusha: When I joined them, I was actually hired to be a technical writer for them. John Shegerian: OK. Kimberly Erusha: I had done my Master’s and PhD in Turf Grass Management and had done a lot of work in extension when I was going through school, so it was to take our research information and then to translate that into the layman’s language. John Shegerian: Interesting. Kimberly Erusha: That’s where it evolved from. Started there, and really got a lot of great exposure to many different things that the USGA did, and took on the role of managing director for the Green Section about four years ago. John Shegerian: For our listeners and viewers out there, to find more about all the great work you’re doing at the USGA, it’s www.USGA.org. Talk a little bit about the greening of the USGA. Obviously, just from a laymen’s perspective, it looks like a very amazing opportunity to be green. Kimberly Erusha: Absolutely. John Shegerian: With all the gorgeous grass that we’ve seen and everything else. The superintendents at each course have an important role to play. How do you manage the greening of the USGA? And talk a little bit about the journey itself, the beginning and where you are today in terms of making the golf industry more sustainable. Kimberly Erusha: Well, the USGA, as an organization, is an interesting body. What we really do as an organization is we write the rules of golf in cooperation with the RNA. John Shegerian: Wow. Kimberly Erusha: We have a handicap system that helps golfers of all levels play against each other. In addition to the rules of golf, we do all the equipment testing. So that is really on the governance side of the game of golf. John Shegerian: Right. Kimberly Erusha: But another part that people really don’t know about the USGA is we also have a department called the “Green Section,” which is the group that I’m with. John Shegerian: OK. Kimberly Erusha: And that is the ergonomic or working with superintendents on how golf courses are managed. So we really recognize that not only do you have to bring golfers into the game of golf, but you have to have the balance of having great golf facilities for golfers to play at, and that’s where we’re at in that part of the organization – and we have to make sure that they’re not only sustainable on the environmental front, but they also have to be economically viable as a business as well, and it’s important about how do you find that balance. John Shegerian: Now, for a layman, like me, about golf – I’m a huge fan, but I’m not a big golf player – how many courses does the USGA have sort of governance over in the United States or the world? How big is your reach? Kimberly Erusha: Well, we work cooperatively with the RNA, and so that is golf courses around the world. John Shegerian: Wow. Kimberly Erusha: For the USGA, we do golf courses in the United States, in Canada and in Mexico, and what we are trying to do is, it’s really important that we believe that to be able to manage golf facilities it has to be based on good science. And that’s why since the Green Section was started back in 1920, the start of that was for the purpose of research and it was to develop new grasses for the game of golf that are better suited for the environment. We want them to use less water, less pesticides and to be able to withstand environmental stresses, and that’s where we’re trying to find that balance. John Shegerian: This is fascinating. So you’re saying that the USGA – way before it was cool to be green and people were driving hybrids and Teslas and everything else that we see going on right now in the sustainability revolution, back in the 1920s – the USGA was already onto this and the importance of running a sustainable golf course. Kimberly Erusha: Yes. We didn’t call it that at that time. John Shegerian: No. Kimberly Erusha: We look at that kind of terminology of where it is now, but when you look back over the history of the organization, that’s really what we’ve been trying to do is to make sure that we’ve got a great environment for the game of golf. And we know that you’ve got to balance those costs to be able to have a great golf facility, to be able to have high quality playing surfaces. John Shegerian: Wow. Kimberly Erusha: And the interesting thing that comes out of a lot of that research is, although we’re doing research specifically for golf at Languet Universities across the country, not all of those products are necessarily going to work the best for golf. Well, the benefits from that benefits at the home lawns, at sports fields, where your kids are playing soccer, at your municipal sports facilities so it really helps turf grass as an industry as well as golf as an industry. John Shegerian: That’s fascinating. So what initiatives have you been managing and have been getting – so to speak – traction in terms of sustainability in the golf industry at the USGA? What are some of your more interesting and exciting wins that you’ve gotten in terms of sustainability? Kimberly Erusha: Well, I’m certainly very proud of a lot of the research that has taken place. John Shegerian: Yeah. Kimberly Erusha: But you have to look at, how do you get that information into the hands of people that are managing the courses themselves? John Shegerian: Which are the superintendents. Kimberly Erusha: Which is the golf course superintendent. They got into the industry because they loved being outdoors, they appreciate the environment. Well, we want to make sure that we’re taking the latest research information and getting it into their hands so that they can apply it. So we have a course consulting service where we do consulting with golf facilities one-on-one to be able to help them take that research information and put it into the field itself. Well, the best thing you get out of that by our agronomists who visit those golf facilities, they see some of the best things that happen in the field and we’re able to capture that information and put it into a very broad research and education and outreach program to be able to get that into the hands of golf facilities not only in our jurisdiction of the U.S., Canada and Mexico but around the world to share that information. John Shegerian: Is that all via technology? Kimberly Erusha: Definitely. John Shegerian: Wow. Kimberly Erusha: Many things go out over the Internet. We have a water resource center where we really pool that information together to talk about the importance of managing water. John Shegerian: That’s a hot topic now in sustainability – obviously – not only here in the United States but around the world. How are you meeting that challenge in terms of how are golf courses – what are the best practices now on savings as much water but still running a sustainable and beautiful and playable golf course? Kimberly Erusha: Well, you have to look at using a lot of tools that are in the tool box that are out there. So for the golf course superintendents, it’s things like making sure that you’re using current weather data to be able to make decisions on how you’re actually applying water. But then you also have to know how much water is in the soil before I even apply. So we have things like handheld water meters and moisture meters, and there are actually in-ground sensors that are in putting greens to be able to measure the moisture before irrigation is actually applied. John Shegerian: Wow. Kimberly Erusha: So where golf course management used to be based on a lot of what we call the “art of management” of saying – we’re looking at the weather and saying the grass looks about like this, now we’re actually using those tools and technologies to say. John Shegerian: Science now. Kimberly Erusha: Science. We want it based on science. We believe that science is a critical component, and we consider it priority of how to manage golf courses. John Shegerian: And technology has given you the bridge to take the science and make it very seeable in real-time by your superintendents. Kimberly Erusha: Absolutely. John Shegerian: Wow. That is so interesting. Talk a little bit about grass. You mentioned all the research you’ve done in grass. How has grass evolved since the 1920s to now, and is it in the best place ever in terms of the genetics and how you’ve evolved the grass industry? Kimberly Erusha: Well, we look at different grasses and varieties that are available so when we say you’re going to go out and – whether it’s renovate a golf course or if it’s under new construction – say, “How do you pick the best grass?” Well, a lot of those grasses have gone through years of testing. We know how well they do against environmental stresses so what we’re trying to do is say, “Let’s pick the grass that is best adapted to that area.” So there are new grasses out there now like Buffalo grass, which can be used in out-of-play areas that can use only about an inch of water per month. It’s just one of those. It’s native to the United States, so in out of play areas, it can be a great alternative versus something that has to be irrigated, mowed and have pesticide products put onto it. Then we look at other grasses like Seashore Paspalum. This is a new grass that is available, and it has a great salt tolerance so you’re able to irrigate with water that is much lower quality, higher salts, and it’s able to give you a very quality playing surface and can use lower quality water. John Shegerian: Wow. If you’ve just joined us, we’ve got Dr. Kimberly Erusha. She is the Managing Director of the USGA – that is the United States Golf Association. Please go to www.USGA.org to learn more about all the green effort they’re making in their industry. And to learn more about the Green Sports Alliance, please go to www.GreenSportsAlliance.org. We were just talking about grass. Talk a little bit about the golfers themselves. How do you get the golfers involved in your mission in making sustainability a priority and visible with regards to your golf courses? Kimberly Erusha: Well, we have – golfers play a very important role. They are certainly the consumer of the product. They have expectations of what they would like to see on the golf course so we talk about how do you manage those expectations themselves. John Shegerian: Right. Kimberly Erusha: We’re trying to provide a high-quality playing surface, and that is going to be especially on the putting greens. But you think about 70 percent of a golf course are really areas that are out-of-play. John Shegerian: Wow. Kimberly Erusha: So we can manage those much more sustainably, but we need to talk to golfers about it doesn’t have to be perfectly green, it doesn’t have to be without blemishes. One of the beauties about the game of golf is the variation with it. It’s an outdoor sport and it’s one of those where you don’t quite know what you’re going to get every time you hit the ball, whether it’s by yourself or whether it’s the golf course itself. John Shegerian: Very true. Right. Kimberly Erusha: So by managing golfers’ expectations, golf course superintendents could really produce a great product. But we also have to make sure that golfers recognize that it takes a lot of inputs to produce a perfectly manicured golf course, and that is really not the goal. The goal is to have a high-quality golf course. But it’s OK to have some blemishes on it. John Shegerian: Talk a little bit about these golfers, though. Like with all athletes, some of the athletes are nerds and they really love the science. How much of them are really taking what you’re publishing and the information and the knowledge that you have and actually thinking about it, and actually using it to improve their game, but also to improve the Earth in terms of how they live and everything else? How much is this science being taken up by the golfers themselves? Kimberly Erusha: That’s what the interesting thing is that I’ve been definitely learning over the years is, you talk about this – and I only because I was raised on the science end of it and the extension and the education – it’s always fascinating to see how you’ll talk to golfers about some things that are how a golf course is – why we have to aerate so that we’re producing good oxygen exchange, a good water infiltration – and then they’ll say, “I never thought of it that way.” So golfers are interested in it and it’s good to be able to say, “This is also what you could do in your own home lawn,” and we talk about it even to children. We have some STEM outreach programs. We’re trying to take these same concepts and be able to use golf as the vehicle, as the sport to be able to give these concepts to kids as well. So I think the interest is there with golfers. We have to just keep learning how to subtly weave that message into their everyday golfing experience. John Shegerian: One question before we start talking about USGA and GSA. Pesticides. What is going on with pesticides now in terms of the use of them? Is there less use of pesticides? Has pesticides evolved to the point where they’re less toxic to humans or to the environment at large? What has happened with that industry since time immemorial? Since – say – the 1920s where you started collection research? Kimberly Erusha: Well, you think about the whole pesticide industry overall, it has evolved lightyears over the decades. John Shegerian: That’s interesting. Kimberly Erusha: All of those products that get produced for the marketplace certainly go through testing, very long-term testing through our Environmental Protection Agency – the EPA. So you have to think about it when you’re actually applying those products, it’s costing that golf facility money to apply the products. So the idea behind it is let’s find a good balance. Let’s make sure we’re trying to irrigate properly, we’re trying to aerate the soil properly and we’re trying to control traffic on the golf course so that we can really focus on having a healthy plant, and that is going to minimize the amount that you have to use pesticides. John Shegerian: That’s great. Kimberly Erusha: So the idea is finding the right balance. Those products – when you have to use them according to label directions – we say that for ourselves in the golf industry, we certainly encourage that for the homeowner market as well, it’s about always finding the right balance. But the No. 1 thing we’re trying to do is get a healthy plant first because, ultimately, that is going to be less pesticides that are going to go on to the product. John Shegerian: Great point. I love it. That makes sense. So we’re here at the Green Sports Alliance annual event. When did you get involved with the Green Sports Alliance and bring the USGA into the Green Sports Alliance? Kimberly Erusha: It was interesting because this is actually my first summit that I have been to so it’s been a great exposure to people talking about sustainability issues, and it’s been interesting because many times they’re talking about more venues that are standard structures. Ours is an outdoor game, but it’s interesting of how you can pick up points about recycling and proper use of pesticide products and just communicating that message. And, more importantly, engaging the fan. Hearing some of those things has given me a lot of good ideas that we’re going to be able to take back to the USGA and also apply that to what we do. John Shegerian: Is this USGA’s first time at a summit actually? Kimberly Erusha: At this summit, yes. John Shegerian: Green Sports Alliance. Really? Kimberly Erusha: Yes. John Shegerian: That’s exciting. Kimberly Erusha: It’s the first time that we have been here. Although we have been involved with many of these organizations on a one-on-one basis, this is the first time we’ve attended this summit. John Shegerian: And what were your goals coming into here, and now that it’s sort of starting to wind down, did you achieve your goals? Kimberly Erusha: I think the goals coming into it were certainly to see what the whole objectives were of the summit itself and to meet as many people as possible. It was very well organized to be able to really capitalize on that so I’ve really had some very interesting conversations – some where you can certainly directly impact on what we’re doing and others just to be able to say, “This is how broad the sustainability field is.” It may be products that we would never use within our field, but it really goes to show you, across industries overall, how it impacts so many different companies. John Shegerian: It’s always fun to hear who was the final straw. Who pulled you in? Who called you up and said, “Kimberly, come on. You’ve got to come. We’re all going to Chicago together and this is going to be fun. You’re really going to love it.” Kimberly Erusha: Well, actually, the interesting thing that came was I’m going to be speaking this afternoon on a panel about better use of water and so there was an opening on that panel. John Shegerian: There you go. Kimberly Erusha: So that’s what brought me in. John Shegerian: And who else is on that panel today with you? Do you know some of the other folks? Kimberly Erusha: They are from various industries. It’s a very broad scope so it’s going to be interesting to see how they tie it all together. So some of it is actually companies themselves and then it’s a group like mine that actually use water directly to produce a product. John Shegerian: Speaking of water how much have you followed that industry in terms of desalination and recycling and other water-saving tools? Is that a big part of what you do also? Researching the state-of-the-art technology with regards to water and water reclamation? Kimberly Erusha: We definitely do. If you think about it, we’re dealing with a living plant and water is a key part of our business model, just like it is with any industry, but because we’re dealing with actually landscape planting material, water is paramount to what we do. We’ve recognized for years that it’s been an issue and it will continue to be. For example, through our research program, since the early 1980s, that’s really where we said, “We’ve got to develop grasses that use less water,” and that’s where we started down that path to be able to really do that. But you have to have the technologies that go with it, too. John Shegerian: Wow. So that is an important part. Researching the technologies is also part of what you do at the USGA. Kimberly Erusha: We’ve got to have the balance between not only developing the grasses themselves, but you have to know how to manage them. So those two are going to go hand-in-hand so that we can get that information into the hands of the superintendent who is going to ultimately take care of our playing surface. John Shegerian: Well, thank you for sharing your story. Thank you for sharing the USGA story today with our viewers and our listeners. This has been Dr. Kimberly Erusha. She is the Managing Director of all things green and sustainable at the USGA. To learn more about the USGA, please go to www.USGA.org. To learn more about the Green Sports Alliance, please go to www.GreenSportsAlliance.org. Kimberly, it has been an honor to interview you. I’m so glad we had a chance to meet you and so glad you came to the Green Sports Alliance. Kimberly Erusha: Thank you. John Shegerian: You are making the world a greener and better place and are truly living proof that Green Is Good. Thank you so much. Kimberly Erusha: Thank you.

John Shegerian: Welcome to another edition of Green Is Good. This is the Green Sports Alliance edition of Green Is Good in beautiful downtown Chicago, and we are so honored to have with us today, Andrea Curry. She is the VP of Product Management for SHIFT Energy. Welcome to Green Is Good. Andrea Curry: Thank you. John Shegerian: So, Andrea, before we get talking about SHIFT Energy, share a little bit about your story, your journey leading up to becoming the VP of Product Management. How did you end up there? Andrea Curry: Sure. It’s actually one of those things. I guess lots of good things start this way. I worked for SHIFT’s parent company – Mariner Partners – and they sent me down to SHIFT on a two-day assignment about three-and-a-half years ago. And I am a crunchy person – I guess you would say. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: When I got down there, I guess I just felt that there was a big opportunity in this space and that we had the opportunity to help make the world a better place, and we sort of dug in and went from there. John Shegerian: Now, you are originally from Canada and Canada, typically, in the cities that I have had the pleasure of visiting – Toronto, Montreal, Vancouver – is a very green country. Andrea Curry: Yeah. We try. John Shegerian: So SHIFT is based in Canada. What is the general mission and business model of SHIFT Energy? Andrea Curry: So we are a software company, so we are trying to bring technological advancement to the built environment – if you will – and, in particular, right now, we’re focusing on very energy-intensive buildings like arenas, stadiums, hospitals, those kinds of things. So essentially software has the ability to – with almost no environmental footprint – trim energy waste out of facilities just through the advancements that things like big data analytics computing can have. It really can be a game changer. So we’re trying to insert software in that equation and essentially share – how the model works is we go into a facility, and without any real investment from the facility, we’re able to trim waste and then save costs and work that back in. John Shegerian: So it’s just wasted energy? Andrea Curry: Wasted energy. Exactly. John Shegerian: So it’s, basically, SHIFT Energy is just focused on energy savings. Andrea Curry: Exactly. Yeah. John Shegerian: Wow. Andrea Curry: So water, natural gas, electricity, those things. John Shegerian: So this is proprietary software that was designed and developed in-house. Andrea Curry: That’s right. John Shegerian: And how many years ago did you launch this? Andrea Curry: We launched it last year in partnership with the Vancouver Canucks, actually. John Shegerian: Really? Andrea Curry: They were an early adopter in the sporting space. They loaned up Rogers Arena to co-develop this product, and we were able to save 20 percent of their energy costs, and that’s a 20 percent reduction in their carbon footprint as well. So it had monumental effects, and we launched last June, and we’ve been working with them to commercialize on that. John Shegerian: Wow. That’s a great calling card to have to start your business venture, right? Andrea Curry: It is, yeah. John Shegerian: Is the business model – and I don’t want to get too economic or share any proprietary secrets, but is the business model you charge for the software or you take a piece of the savings? Andrea Curry: Either. John Shegerian: Oh. Andrea Curry: We have both models so a customer can either buy it outright and own it and we support it or they can pay out of the savings as you go. John Shegerian: Which is basically a no-risk deal. Andrea Curry: Exactly. John Shegerian: And everyone wins. Andrea Curry: Exactly. John Shegerian: There is a great ROI on that for everybody because you believe in your product so much. Andrea Curry: Exactly. We believe in the savings, and we think that even in facilities that might feel like they are fully optimized from an energy efficiency standpoint, this technology opens up a new opportunity and really expands what is possible so we can typically still make significant improvements. John Shegerian: For our listeners and viewers out there, to find Andrea and SHIFT Energy, please go to www.ShiftEnergy.com. How many years ago did you join? Andrea Curry: About three-and-a-half years ago. John Shegerian: So when you were joining and you were talking to your CEO – Brock Sansom – how many competitors – when you look at the competitive landscape, this sounds like a no-brainer that there should be 50 different companies doing this, but is this really that unique and that proprietary that you’ve got really the better mousetrap here? Andrea Curry: I think so. John Shegerian: Well, that’s good. Andrea Curry: As the product manager. John Shegerian: You’re the VP of Product Management. Andrea Curry: It does seem that there is a lot of noise in the energy efficiency space. John Shegerian: Yes. Andrea Curry: There is a lot going on. There are a lot of people who claim that they have the technology. John Shegerian: Of course. Andrea Curry: In truth, we are really the only people who can make these incremental savings at this time. Now, I’m sure we will have competitors emerge as word gets out and we do have patents – or patents pending, I should say. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: But I think there will continue to be an influx of people into this kind of thing. John Shegerian: But you’re the leader. Andrea Curry: And good for them. There should be. John Shegerian: And good for them, yeah. Andrea Curry: It will make us better. John Shegerian: But, I mean, I’m sure the Canucks were approached by all sorts of people and all sorts of organizations and you won the bid and then you saved them 20 percent. Andrea Curry: Well, they’re a very savvy early adoption organization, I would say, and the team on the ground there had hired – really – the industry’s best in terms of who is running their facility. John Shegerian: Sure. Andrea Curry: And they were able to weed through the noise. John Shegerian: That’s awesome. Andrea Curry: And they knew this was a new thing that they hadn’t tried, and they gave it a shot. John Shegerian: Can you share with our listeners and viewers a little bit what is your energy optimization – EOS – program and how does it work? Andrea Curry: Yeah sure. So essentially EOS is the name of our product. It sits in the cloud and we integrate with buildings in the commercial environment, and most large buildings already have basic control in place so they have some sort of building automation system. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: We just layer on top of that building automation system. Every minute we grab all the data from the building, we ship it off to the cloud, we do some really complicated math. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: We come up with a better plan as to how the building could still meet the same requirements – not be hotter or colder. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: Still meet the same requirements but in a more energy efficient manner. Then we essentially write back to that same building automation system to physically make changes. So if you think about it we’re almost like the Uber operator – if you would. John Shegerian: Wow. Andrea Curry: If an operator could physically change 250 set points every minute in a building based on some predictive math and algorithms. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: Then it’s possible. But, obviously, that doesn’t scale in a building that size, so we automate that process. John Shegerian: So you use big data and predictive analytics and software and technology to make this happen. Andrea Curry: Exactly. John Shegerian: Two questions. I am so fascinated by what you are doing and because of this show I am so lucky to meet so many great leaders like you so I get a little bit of knowledge – enough where I’m dangerous – so here’s a question. So I have an arena that I want you to help me save energy in or some big public venue. So there are two opportunities. One, my operator has saved every record from day one on what we’ve spent on energy, how the arena runs in terms of the events that we have, and we hand that over to you. Andrea Curry: Right. John Shegerian: What about when there is less information? When you walk into a place that hasn’t been run that well, that has gone through many managers and they don’t have all the documents in one nice file like they should to be able to help you do what you do best, are you able still to be able to still pull a hat out of a rabbit? Andrea Curry: Yeah. We do. Utilities keep datas forever. John Shegerian: OK. Andrea Curry: So we can always go back to the utility with the customer’s permission and get utility billing information. John Shegerian: Got you. Andrea Curry: That is not – that’s great. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: But in terms of understanding what happened in the building, we can get a much tighter baseline and understand our impact a lot tighter if we also had some history in terms of when that has happened. John Shegerian: So more information makes you better. Andrea Curry: Makes us better. We’ll still optimize the building, but what we won’t know is how much impact we had in a short period of time so we’ll have to run for a much longer period of time. John Shegerian: To run your beta. Andrea Curry: Exactly. For the variants – essentially – to normalize. John Shegerian: Got you. Andrea Curry: Then after a year we can say, “OK, we saved 20 percent.” But month one will be like, “We’re saving somewhere between five and 50 percent.” John Shegerian: Got you. Whereas when you have all the documents and you have all the historical data literally right out of the box, first month, second month, you’re able to give great information back. Andrea Curry: Exactly. And sometimes what we’ll do is we’ll run for a period of time and collect minute-by-minute data and then try and apply that back to the baseline as an explainer. John Shegerian: Wow. Yeah. Andrea Curry: And that is helpful but still you have a very good understanding – I would say – of the situation. John Shegerian: What other savings – besides energy savings in terms of sustainability or reportable benefits on the building owner or the operator or the team owner, sustainability, environmental footprint, carbon reduction, what other benefits will we be able to report on and SHIFT Energy is able to get from this property? Andrea Curry: So operational efficiency would be one. John Shegerian: OK. Andrea Curry: So if you think about it machines run buildings pretty well. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: Except for exception scenarios where an operator needs to get engaged. So in terms of, if you tell us that this room at this time needs to be between 68 and 72 degrees, it will be between 68 and 72 degrees. John Shegerian: Really? Andrea Curry: If it’s physically possible with the [inaudible] in the building. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: So we’d end up with fewer complaints and better operating conditions. We also drastically improve the asset life because we typically run the building less hard, we run it leaner. Kind of think of Lean Six Sigma but applied to the built environment. John Shegerian: Using software to bring lean to the machines. Andrea Curry: Exactly. John Shegerian: Wow. That’s interesting. Andrea Curry: So we found in our health pilot that we’re just wrapping up with the University Health Network in Toronto that in some cases we’re running the building 50 percent as hard as previously. John Shegerian: So then the machines can last double as long. Andrea Curry: Double as long, which has a huge impact. John Shegerian: Double life. Wow. Andrea Curry: So that’s exciting. John Shegerian: As the building owner or the manager will you then provide me a dashboard of information that I’m able then to use for my CSR reporting and other things? Andrea Curry: Absolutely. We started as a dashboard company. John Shegerian: Really? Andrea Curry: So we are rooted deeply in analytics. We would always give kind of these to-do lists to our customers and say, “Here are the things you need to do to be energy efficient.” But of course people have day jobs and often they didn’t get to the list, and really where this came from was how can we solve that problem? How do we make that go away and just action the change? And that’s why we got into it. John Shegerian: Got you. If you’ve just joined us now, we’ve got Andrea Curry with us. She is the VP of Product Management at SHIFT Energy. To learn more about SHIFT Energy, please go to www.ShiftEnergy.com. You “guarantee persistent savings.” What does “persistent savings” mean in your vernacular? Andrea Curry: It means that the savings continue over time. A lot of energy efficiency approaches work really well initially, but the building changes, and as the building changes, then the effectiveness of what you might have set up to operate it more efficiency, unfortunately, it drifts – is the word we use in the industry. But with software and with using this technology, we can sort of dynamicize – if that’s a word – the building. John Shegerian: Right. Yeah. We made it a word right now. Andrea Curry: There it is. There you go. Such that if the conditions change over time, the software reacts over time as well. John Shegerian: Wow. Andrea Curry: So your savings stick around. John Shegerian: It’s a guarantee that you’re not a one-hit wonder. Andrea Curry: Exactly. John Shegerian: Wow. You got the Canucks on board. That is your great calling card. How has it been going to socialize your technology now? How have the sales been going throughout Canada and also in the United States? Andrea Curry: It’s going alright. We have a pretty solid pipeline and the Canucks have been very helpful in that. We are hopefully kicking off a couple of projects in the offseason this summer. John Shegerian: Good. Andrea Curry: So it looks good. We don’t have as much traction as we would like at this point, but no one every does. John Shegerian: No one in charge of sales ever does, right? Andrea Curry: It’s taken us about a year to really build up credibility in the marketplace. John Shegerian: Let’s talk about credibility. When did you get involved – when did SHIFT Energy get involved with the GSA, and why is SHIFT – why are you and Brock – here at the GSA now at the annual conference? Andrea Curry: Green Sports Alliance is a great organization. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: We were actually invited here last year by the Canucks. Michael Doyle – who is one of the founders – is the Executive VP at Rogers Arena. John Shegerian: Got you. Andrea Curry: And he said, “Look, you guys have got to tell the world about this technology.” John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: And this was just at the point of our launch last summer so we were very new and looking to just kind of start our path to commercialization. So we came down, and it was kind of one of those situations where when you’re on a really good date. It felt like “Wow, these guys get us and we get them,” so we see this as a great avenue to bring our technology and other technologies, use sport to improve the adoption and hopefully make a difference. John Shegerian: And your CEO – Brock Sansom – is speaking here? Andrea Curry: He is. He is speaking later today about net-zero buildings. John Shegerian: And talk a little bit about what his thesis is on net-zero buildings. Andrea Curry: Sure. So our approach – or my thought as a real greenie. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: Is the greenest thing you can ever do is not buy anything at all. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: So if you think about software and energy efficiency in particular, we feel like that is the first pillar to net-zero. Then you size and stock your generation and other things that you need on top of that storage, because if you think about it, trimming energy waste out of a utility has no environmental cost. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: There is no manufacturing, shipping, panel, etc. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: There is literally no lifecycle cost to it. So I think what he is going to share today is the roadmap to becoming net zero, what is the greenest way to get there and how does that make sense financially as well. John Shegerian: Got you. So you’re here at the Green Sports Alliance. So not only is Brock speaking but you have a lot of potential clients here. Andrea Curry: We do. John Shegerian: How is that going? Andrea Curry: It’s going pretty well. John Shegerian: Yeah? Andrea Curry: Yeah. What is exciting for us is we have a number of prospects that we have been working with already, and this was a good chance for us to reconnect with them and further some of those things. We’ve met some new folks here this year that are new to the Green Sports Alliance so generally we’ve been busy. John Shegerian: Sports is a great opportunity. What other kinds of venues – for our listeners and our viewers out there – should be using SHIFT Energy’s software and technology? Andrea Curry: So we look at, typically. 500,000-square-feet-and-up kind of range. John Shegerian: Got you. Andrea Curry: So big ones. John Shegerian: Commercial buildings. Andrea Curry: Commercial buildings. Hospitals. The most energy-intensive buildings in particular. Then, in terms of the uniqueness of our solution, you can get at these kinds of savings in a dynamic building that changes day to day, like an arena or a stadium or a hospital. In a static commercial building, you can get some level of the savings and the persistence manually because it’s occupied from nine-to-five. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: So you can do a pretty good job at guessing at that. There is less drift. John Shegerian: Right. Andrea Curry: We still think we’re better – of course – but in terms of a sweet spot, health, sporting venues, other venues. John Shegerian: After the Canucks and the 20 percent you saved for the Canucks, what other success stories has your EOS system had that you can talk about and give shouts-out to? Andrea Curry: So our pilot at University Health Network, we’re achieving about 20 percent savings there now as well. John Shegerian: Wow. Andrea Curry: So that is exciting. So we just launched in health, literally, a few weeks ago at the Clean Man Conference in Portland, Oregon, so we are very excited about that. Then there are a few others that are in the works, but I can’t talk about them yet. John Shegerian: Got it. Andrea Curry: But, hopefully, next year, when we speak, I’ll have a laundry list. John Shegerian: That would be great. Any final thoughts about SHIFT Energy and about what you’re doing here with GSA before we have to say goodbye today? Andrea Curry: No. I guess my one thought would be – going back to what Brock is going to talk about later. John Shegerian: Yeah. Andrea Curry: As you’re looking at your impact on the world, challenge yourself to think about what is possible. Technology has come a long way. What Google has done to the world and Apple has done to the world in the past few years has really opened up and caused a bunch of emerging technologies to really create opportunities where you might not even know they exist. That would be my parting message – dig deep and try to figure out how to put those things together. John Shegerian: That’s a great message, and we thank you for joining us today and sharing the SHIFT Energy story. For our listeners and viewers out there that want to find SHIFT Energy and contact Andrea and use their great software to save money and save energy, please go to www.ShiftEnergy.com. This has been the Green Sports Alliance edition of Green Is Good, and to find the Green Sports Alliance, please go to www.GreenSportsAlliance.org. Andrea Curry, thank you and your colleagues from SHIFT Energy for making the world a better place. You are truly living proof that Green Is Good.

John Shegerian: Welcome to another edition of Green Is Good. This is the Green Sports Alliance edition of Green Is Good, and we’re here in downtown Chicago, and we’ve got with us Will Witherspoon. Welcome to Green Is Good. Will Witherspoon: Yeah. Thanks for having me. It’s a good time. John Shegerian: Now, we’re going to be talking about Shire Gate Farm toda,y but before we get talking about Shire Gate Farm – which is your new venture – I want you to give the Will Witherspoon journey leading up to Shire Gate Farm. Your athletic days and everything. Will Witherspoon: I’m a military kid so that’s always part of it. John Shegerian: Yeah. Will Witherspoon: Travelled the world with my dad and ended up in Panama City, Florida, where we kind of did that. But jumping forward to when I got to college and playing football at the University of Georgia. I did my four years there and enjoyed it – great place which started my professional career. Twelve years in the NFL. Starting Carolina. I played for the Rams, of course. John Shegerian: Wow. Will Witherspoon: Philadelphia and Tennessee in those 12 years. John Shegerian: And you won a Super Bowl with the Rams. Will Witherspoon: Well, actually no. I didn’t win a Super Bowl with the Rams. John Shegerian: Oh, who were you with? Will Witherspoon: I was with the Panthers when we were in the Super Bowl, and we lost that Super bowl to the Patriots in 2003-2004 season. John Shegerian: OK. Will Witherspoon: So February 2004. John Shegerian: And you won the NFC Championship? Will Witherspoon: Won the NFC Championship. Great day. And you asked me earlier. John Shegerian: Yeah, big ring on that. Big ring. Will Witherspoon: If I put this gigantic ring on. It’s like super enormous and put away in a drawer. John Shegerian: Last season, didn’t you lead the team in tackles at some point? Will Witherspoon: Yeah. I’ve led the team in tackles before as the Rams’ 2007 MVP, and of course, in the Super Bowl that I played with in Carolina, I had 18 tackles in that game. A great day. Great day. John Shegerian: Huge. Will Witherspoon: Crazy game to think about. And in the midst of all this now – I don’t want to call it my “new venture” per se, but it’s a new old venture – I started Shire Gate Farm, which is my sustainable grass-fed beef ranch, and am enjoying that. John Shegerian: Will, how did you really come up with that? I mean, you had a fascinating life travelling the world with pops as a military child. You were a Georgia Bulldog so you got a great college education. NFL 12 years. What was the epiphany? Where was sustainability? Where did that come into your life? Will Witherspoon: Well, it starts with the job. John Shegerian: Yeah. Will Witherspoon: When I was playing football, one of the most important things was my diet. What you ate. Making sure you had great food on the plate. So when I bought the first piece of property for Shire Gate – for my horses, essentially – and I went out and bought some cattle to put on the property, I started looking at it and saying, “How would I want to put this beef on my plate? What would I want to produce and how would I want to fill that role for myself?” The easiest thing to come across was to look at it and say, “I want to do something that is great and sustainable,” so I’ve always looked at the beef I produce from hoof to plate. What is the best possible option and the best possible way to produce it? The other side of it is all my kids enjoy it. My oldest daughter is like my chicken house coop girl. At six in the morning, she’s up. John Shegerian: How old is she? Will Witherspoon: She’s 10 now. John Shegerian: And where is your farm? Will Witherspoon: My farm is just about an hour outside of St. Louis. It’s 60 miles southwest in Owensville, Missouri. I’ve got about 700 acres out there. John Shegerian: Wow. Will Witherspoon: A good mix of pasture and forest and creeks and lakes and everything else. It’s a great piece of property that I go out and enjoy whenever I can. John Shegerian: How many children do you have? Will Witherspoon: I’ve got three daughters. John Shegerian: So everyone lives on the farm or everyone lives in the city? Will Witherspoon: We live in St. Louis and, of course, with me still working with the Rams doing the Rams Radio Network, I’ve kind of got to live in town. It’s a little rough to drive 80 miles every day for work. John Shegerian: Right. Will Witherspoon: But you look at it and go, “Alright, we can be here,” but it’s just far enough away, where you’re really out of the loop. My cell phone doesn’t work there, and if you want to call me, you’ve got to call my farm manager’s house and wait ‘til she gets the message to me. John Shegerian: How many people work on the farm for you? Will Witherspoon: Well, basically, there are four full-time employees and then a couple that really come into play – my farm manager and my dad being two of the top in there. My dad is enjoying his retirement – as we like to call it. Pops is pops and that’s what it is and everybody knows him as such. John Shegerian: That’s awesome. Will Witherspoon: But the other employees are really there because moving cattle and range and stuff like that it doesn’t take a ton of extra effort, but moving the bodies around to what you need and where you need them is really the next step. John Shegerian: What does organic beef operation look like? Will Witherspoon: It’s a steady stream of cattle. I think, on the property, really, I only keep about 50 head at a time. John Shegerian: OK. Will Witherspoon: I work with a couple other farmers to produce and raise the cattle there so that way we can efficiently and sustainably produce all the animals we need to produce into the market and put them in a marketplace. So it’s a good steady kind of mechanical operation of how you move animals around from the number of animals that you are moving off the property to the number of animals moving on the property at a time and how you can improve that. How you can improve not only just their livelihood but also the flavor of the plate – is a great way to say it. John Shegerian: Will, what paradigm are you following? Is there a paradigm of organic cattle farming that you saw and said, “I want to replicate that somewhere?” Will Witherspoon: Yeah, actually. I work under the auspices of AWA, which is “Animal Welfare Approved.” As I got into cattle, I learned to really try and do my research and understand what I wanted. And again I asked myself that question, “How would I want to produce this?” and Animal Welfare has done a great job of really putting a great set of rules together. And the other thing is I don’t pay them for that certification. They’re independent. This company comes in and certifies my farm year in and year out, and it’s an independent certification. It’s one that I don’t have to go out and say, “I’ve got to pay you for this certification, so if I’m close, how good are we?” You’re either on the book or you’re not. And if there are adjustments and things, there is a timeframe to adjust and make sure that you can meet their certifications if they’ve made some changes in the rules or what may be happening. John Shegerian: Is there a lot of demand for organic beef now, or do you have to go out and market your beef and make your own marketplace? Will Witherspoon: You do have to market some, but the demand is there. I think you have more so than 10 years ago when I got started, the educated consumer. The consumer is reaching out day in and day out and wanting to know what is out there and what they can get their hands on; whether it be beef or poultry, eggs, cheese, dairy, it doesn’t matter. They are reaching out and trying to find where they can get those products. So there is a market, and yes, you do have to market some because people are reaching into a vast region, a vast marketplace, and the internet has done a great job of that. John Shegerian: Are you just right now just doing cattle? Will Witherspoon: Predominately cattle. I’m working on a couple things now looking at getting into eggs for a couple of the restaurateurs that we work alongside and butcher ships we work alongside as well. Then also working and partnering with two chefs in town locally getting ready to work on opening Community Kitchen, which is going to do food service. John Shegerian: That’s so nice. Will Witherspoon: We’ll do food service delivery, cooking education classes, catering. Just pretty much a full gambit of what people need. The quick and ready prep meal for the soccer mom trying to figure out how she is going to run three kids around and still get dinner on the table. John Shegerian: Can you give a shout out to some of the restaurants or butchers that are now carrying Shire Gate Farm beef? Will Witherspoon: Yeah. Of course, Butch and the Burger here in Chicago. Bullyards is one of the butchers I’ve got in St. Louis. We’ve done things in Nashville – the Standard Nashville, which is a great steakhouse. Will Moon Steakhouse there; they serve Shire Gate Beef, too, as well. And we do things in kind of a rotation with the restaurateurs. Bullyards actually takes a whole animal every week. John Shegerian: Wow. Will Witherspoon: So that’s one that keeps us pretty busy and efficient there. Those are probably three of the top producers. Of course, Community Kitchen is going to be another one when it opens in about three to four weeks there and everything is kind of moving forward. John Shegerian: Obviously, you’re a really smart guy. I mean, unfortunately, we know the stories that have been well told in the media with regards to athletes from all different sports not being able to maintain or save their fortunes and stuff. So now you’ve gone into real estate having all those acres and also organic beef, and obviously, you have a day job still. You’re an announcer. Will Witherspoon: And I do have other businesses, as well. The first business I ever actually started – still animal friendly – it was my doggy daycare in Charlotte, and that was myself and Dan Morgan is one of my partners there and we started that – oh my goodness – now this has almost been 12 years now. So that has been great. John Shegerian: Really? Will Witherspoon: And then, of course, I also own a security automation company called “Professional Automation” in Atlanta. We do everything from safety and security measures, fire safety, communications, energy management systems and things of that nature there. So we cover kind of a full gambit of services around that as well. John Shegerian: Where did this fiscal discipline come from? Did it come from dad or was it something you learned along the way in college and everything else? Will Witherspoon: You learn along the way. I won’t say I haven’t made mistakes, too. John Shegerian: But everyone makes mistakes. Will Witherspoon: That’s what we all do. John Shegerian: We all make mistakes. Will Witherspoon: We’ve all done that. And the good thing is I feel like I’ve made more good mistakes than I have bad ones. John Shegerian: Right. Will Witherspoon: That’s the thing there, and the other thing is I’ve never not had the willingness to ask somebody what I needed or what was going on or what was a question or find someone who has been somewhere in the space that you’re in and learn something from them and then take a decision as to whether or not you want to venture into that space or venture into that line of work as well. John Shegerian: Is there so much demand and is it such a growing trend – organic beef – that you could, with 700 acres, could that get really big one day where you could have 400 or 500 cattle at any given time on that kind of property? Will Witherspoon: Oh yeah. I mean, you could do probably 200-300 head at a time on there, if you really opened up the entire property. But I want to keep Shire Gate kind of as the family farm was meant to be. John Shegerian: Right. Will Witherspoon: So you’re probably not going to see many more than 50 head at a time on the property. But it’s also including chickens or sheep and some pigs or horses. It’s going to be a full working farm – is the whole picture – and also show people that sustainable farms and sustainable agriculture should be not only part of what was our nation’s history and past, but it should be part of the future in the long run and part of what is going to feed the future. John Shegerian: That’s great. For our listeners and guests who just tuned, in we’ve got Will Witherspoon with us. He is the owner of Shire Gate Farm. You can find Shire Gate Farm at www.ShireGateFarm.com. Talk a little bit about next steps for you. Obviously, you have a career in broadcasting. How many months a year are you doing the broadcasting stuff? Will Witherspoon: You know the broadcasting is, of course, primarily through the season, but really this year coming up, I’ve already kind of started discussing doing some more year round things so I’ll basically stay pretty busy with broadcasting year round, but the farm is a big piece of what I want to do. I always want to take some time to travel and do things for that. Just like being here at the Green Sports Alliance. This is always part of it. It’s not only tying my sustainable agriculture but my job in working with the Rams and being in professional sports together; those two need to coincide and just to give people another direction. John Shegerian: When you were an athlete, did you always know you wanted to be an announcer when you got out? Will Witherspoon: No. I actually was just – I just enjoy what’s going on. And, actually, when Artis called me and said, “Hey, we need a sideline guy and everybody kept putting your name in the pot.” John Shegerian: Wow. Will Witherspoon: So when that came out I literally said, “Hey, perfect, I’ll do it,” and it’s not a problem and I enjoy it. John Shegerian: So that’s what you do for the L.A. Rams; you’re the sideline guy. Will Witherspoon: Yeah. And right now, it’s considerably the St. Louis Rams. Be careful with that. John Shegerian: I’m sorry. Yeah. I’m sorry. Right. Will Witherspoon: There’s a lot up in the air about that one. John Shegerian: Yeah. Right. Will Witherspoon: But don’t worry, we’ll get you right. Like just what you said “wiping from the bottom up.” This is the funniest thing I’ve ever seen. John Shegerian: Explain to our viewers. Will Witherspoon: So as we’re walking through the Green Sports Alliance, Solaris Paper here, which is a sustainable paper sourcing for toilet paper, it’s really hilarious. John Shegerian: Right. Will Witherspoon: I’m picking up a couple, and they wrap these in football skins and he was like, “I just wrapped 100 of these so I figured you might want these.” John Shegerian: This is great. Will Witherspoon: And I was like, “Yeah, that’s pretty solid,” and he goes, “Now you’re green from the bottom up,” and I was like, “Well, ain’t that something.” You can’t say anything more there. John Shegerian: This is great. Will Witherspoon: So now you can get Solaris Paper and be “green from the bottom up.” John Shegerian: Green from the bottom up. You’ve heard it here from Will Witherspoon first. That’s awesome. You’re here at the GSA. Is this your first year at the GSA? Will Witherspoon: No, actually. Last year was my first year at the GSA so I was out in California. John Shegerian: And you were speaking last year? Will Witherspoon: Spoke last year – yeah – in a little smaller deal. John Shegerian: Last year, what did you speak on, Will? Will Witherspoon: We spoke a lot on food service as well. John Shegerian: OK. Will Witherspoon: So staying in that. And last year was the first year that Shire Gate actually serviced Edward Jones Dome in St. Louis with hotdogs and burgers. John Shegerian: Oh nice. Will Witherspoon: So that was a big step when Kevin – the vice president of the team – came up and goes, “Hey. We want to see about if you want to put your hotdogs in the stands. Can you do 12,000 hotdogs and 25,000 burgers?” “Yeah, I’ll figure it out; just give me a minute.” John Shegerian: Right. Will Witherspoon: “I know I’ve got some in stock, but we’ll work out the rest.” And that was short notice – only a few weeks before the first game – and it was a little bit of a rush around. John Shegerian: Scramble. Right. Will Witherspoon: Little bit of a scramble. But I knew we had things coming to the pipeline where I could produce more product and get things together. John Shegerian: But that is the life of an entrepreneur. Will Witherspoon: Yeah. John Shegerian: And you’re also an entrepreneur. Will Witherspoon: Definitely. John Shegerian: So saying yes and then figuring it out is really what it’s all about. Will Witherspoon: Exactly. Always say “yes” because you can always go back to saying “no.” John Shegerian: That’s right. Will Witherspoon: And say, “You know what maybe this didn’t work out this time, but we can work to the next step.” John Shegerian: That’s brilliant. Talk a little bit about, what does sustainable beef look like? What makes a piece of beef sustainable? Will Witherspoon: Well, let’s start with how the animal is produced. The animals, we produce and raise in a natural cycle. And by that, I mean cows are meant to eat grass. They’re not meant to be fed high protein corn the entire time. And what people have as this misunderstanding is that corn is our predominant factor to feed commodity beef, but you can do the same thing to a cow if you give it really high protein grasses the entire time. So if you were to feed a cow nothing but alfalfa, you would have the same problems as you do with corn. It’s just the way it is. But getting back to grass-fed and sustainably produced products, you’re going to get typically what is a true steak sizing in serving portion, you’re going to get something that is greater in omega threes, better in LDL, which are your low-density lipids, which are the better fats for you, higher protein per serving typically. And you’re also not going to get this bleach-y white fat. It’s going to be a little more traditional, kind of yellowed. A lot of people were kind of edgy in not knowing and understanding that, but that actually comes from not having the acids within the system. John Shegerian: Right. Will Witherspoon: You’re not bleaching it out in that same format. John Shegerian: We’re all used to the bleach and now you see it the other way, and it’s like, “What is this?” Will Witherspoon: Exactly. So you have a more natural cut of beef. I mean, I’ve got a guy that lives out near the farm. He just turned 103, and he was like, “Yeah, this is how beef used to taste.” John Shegerian: Wow. Will Witherspoon: So it’s kind of funny to see that you have someone who has been around long enough to understand that difference and really get their input in it and be proud to say I must be doing something right because I brought it back to a point where somebody understands really this is what it is and this is how it used to be and this is how a family would raise their own homestead and do that. John Shegerian: Wow. That’s so nice. And in the marketplace, when you go out and market, it is butchers, restaurateurs, chefs. Will Witherspoon: Retailers. John Shegerian: Willing to pay a little bit more? Will Witherspoon: Yeah. I mean you can work on work on it in many different facets. I mean, the butchers and chefs – one of the great things about it now is you’re seeing more diversity in the fact that they’re willing to utilize the whole animal. John Shegerian: Interesting. Will Witherspoon: Before, it always came down to “I want steak” or “I want this cut” or “I want that cut.” You see really now they’re buying the whole animal and utilizing that because the consumers are asking for more various parts and pieces. And as I think we were just talking about earlier in our little presentation, this Top Chef world and food world that we’re seeing, you see that people are trying to create and recreate some of these great creations. Chefs are using what used to be experimental parts of animals. John Shegerian: Right. And then so what did you talk on specifically at this year’s GSA? Will Witherspoon: Again, we talked about food services, how we can get the consumer to push for the right foods. And the other part is trying to meet that demand. I’ve got 700 acres, but I promise you you’ve got – Aramark that was just in here talking to us and Levy Foods and they’re talking about 2.5 million pounds of hotdogs a year each so that is 5 million pounds of hotdogs to produce just for baseball. That’s not including football, hockey, basketball or any other sports venues. So you can only imagine. And when you have a market that likes grass-fed or sustainably produced products, it’s produced on a much smaller scale and there is no commodity and no huge conglomerate of people working together. So yeah, it would take a significant amount of us to work together to produce just that, just to meet that portion of the demand. And not to mention what else would be left over that you’d have to get rid of. John Shegerian: Right. Will Witherspoon: I mean, if you get 2.5 million pounds of hotdogs, that means you probably have about 3.5 million pounds of the rest of the cuts. John Shegerian: Really. Wow. Talk about the next five years for Will Witherspoon personally and for Shire Gate Farm. Will Witherspoon: For me, I think I see the same steps. Growing – one – in my broadcast career, just growing in that and enjoying it. It keeps me around the sport that I love and in the game that I love and that’s a part of it. But also the same for Shire Gate and growing piece by piece. This year, we’re getting ready to roll into poultry some and do some poultry for some restaurateurs. And some of these same butchers also have some requests for turkey, which is going to be interesting, too. A lot of people, instead of chicken stock, are making turkey stock now, a more bold kind of little sweeter stock that a lot of people are using for their bases there. But it’s, again, whole bird processes and whole bird ideals where people are buying and producing these animals in that quantity, in that nature. John Shegerian: Is one animal more difficult than the other to have on Shire Gate? Will Witherspoon: No. That again comes back to the sustainability part, where you really want to produce the animals in a sustainable environment, where you’re having the cows out there eating that grass, where you can put your chickens and your turkeys out there to eat the insects that are eating within the grass and doing that and they’re also putting down a different type of fertilizer. That’s the next step in how to keep the health of the land and help the land be productive. John Shegerian: That’s right. Will Witherspoon: Same thing if you put them in and they’re working alongside with your sheep or goats or things of that nature. It’s just the cycle of life and how you can work it out. John Shegerian: So just for fun, five years from now. You close your eyes when you go to bed at night and you think “Shire Gate is going to be this,” what’s it going to be five years from now? Will Witherspoon: Five years from now, I think Shire Gate is going to be one of the names that you see as kind of a great example of what modern sustainable agriculture is like in the protein side for sure and how people can come by and visit the farm and take kids out there and say, “Hey, this is what you can do and this is how this is done,” and educate them, too. John Shegerian: One day can you take Shire Gate and have one or two specific products that can be in every Whole Foods or every store that you can be promoting that you would be excited about? Will Witherspoon: Yeah. I think so. I think that’s always a possibility and one that you’ve got to work in bits and pieces and do the right way and you’ve got to do it efficiently. And the other thing is when you’re talking about sustainability, you don’t want to say you’re going to be in every store because there are some far out reaching things, and things that you don’t want to do there. I don’t think that’s a part of it. But another part of it is – for me – to have Shire Gates in basically several different parts of the region or of the country and make that happen. John Shegerian: Right. That’s awesome. Will Witherspoon: So then you meet that demand and that’s the way you look at it and go “this is how we’re going to do this step and this is how we’re going to do the next step.” John Shegerian: Well, Will, you’re the type of guy that I know is going to get this done. We’re going to be back at GSA next year. You’re going to be hopefully back at GSA. We’ll be back here together. Will Witherspoon: Looking forward to it. John Shegerian: And we’ll be able to continue the story on Green Is Good on the journey of Shire Gate Farm. Will Witherspoon: Yes. Thank you. I’m looking forward to it. And we’ll make sure we’ve got the bottom up covered, too. John Shegerian: For our viewers and our listeners out there, you’ve been listening to Will Witherspoon here on Green is Good, and to learn more about what Will is doing and all his great things and to buy his beef, please go to www.ShireGateFarm.com. Will Witherspoon is green from the bottom up. Will, you are making the world a better place. Will Witherspoon: Thank you. John Shegerian: And are truly living proof that Green Is Good. Thank you so much for joining us today. Will Witherspoon: Yeah. Thank you. Thanks for having me on. John Shegerian: Thank you. Will Witherspoon: Great time.

John Shegerian: Welcome to another edition of Green Is Good. This is the Green Sports Alliance edition of Green Is Good, and we are so honored to have with us today Jeff Hansbro. He is a Senior Technology and Sustainability Leader at Dow Olympic and Sports Solutions. Welcome to Green Is Good, Jeff. Jeff Hansbro: Thank you, John. Good to be here. John Shegerian: Jeff, before we get talking about everything you’re doing at Dow Olympic and Sports Solutions, can you share with our listeners first a little bit about your journey – the Jeff Hansbro story? Jeff Hansbro: Sure. So I am a chemical engineer undergrad with an advanced degree in product design and development. I’ve been with Dow for about 15 years now in various roles of technology leadership. Most recently – over the past five or six years – I’ve moved into more of a building science, building technology engineering leadership role, and a lot of that movement has been my own personal ambitions internally. I’m married. I have a two-year-old son and one more on the way so this journey that I’m on is personal as well as business-related to move more into the environmental side of how I can do good with my background as well as professionally. John Shegerian: That makes sense. That’s a lot of sense. And for our listeners and viewers out there that want to learn more about all the great work you’re doing at Dow, they can go to just www.Dow.com. So talk a little bit about what you’re doing with regards to carbon footprint management at Dow Olympic and Sports Solutions, and what is the key mission of Dow Olympic and Sports Solutions. Jeff Hansbro: OK. So we are a top Olympic worldwide sponsor. We are the official chemistry company of the Olympic movement from 2010 through 2020, and as part of that, we have – it started in Sochi 2014. We developed a carbon mitigation framework to use our economically viable technologies that we would deploy in an area that we agreed upon between the local organizing committee – which at the time it was Sochi 2014. John Shegerian: Right. Jeff Hansbro: To deploy our technologies in the greater Russia area. The deployment of those low-carbon technologies would result in a reduction in greenhouse gas emissions, and we would apply those climate benefits back against the organizing committee’s footprint. So it involved showcasing our technologies in a unique way through a unique framework to be able to place them against their footprint and reduce their footprint. John Shegerian: So how has it been working, and how does that kind of technology work, and what is the success been that you’ve had so far? Jeff Hansbro: We feel it’s working phenomenally because, versus other credits or offsets, we are making an impact in the region of the games. We’ve done this for Sochi 2014. It was the first Olympic Games in history where we were able to mitigate the estimate direct carbon footprint of the organizing committee, which involved in the neighborhood of 520,000 metric tons of carbon prior to the beginning of the games, and we have plans in agreement to be the official carbon partner of Rio 2016 as well to reduce their footprint by approximately 500,000 metric tons. John Shegerian: How do you do that? How do you reduce the carbon footprint, and then how do you manage it and track it? Jeff Hansbro: So we have a framework that is a verified framework built off of the voluntary carbon standard. John Shegerian: Right. Jeff Hansbro: I’ll give you a case. John Shegerian: Yeah. Jeff Hansbro: In the case of a project in Sochi, we took an air sealing foam that is used for energy efficiency means around windows to block air from moving in and out. John Shegerian: OK. Jeff Hansbro: And, at the time, we were an ingredient supplier. We were 6,000 product-plus. The majority of those are ingredients. So we were supplying an ingredient formulation to an air sealing supplier. John Shegerian: Got it. Jeff Hansbro: We took that formulation and – years ahead of regulation – changed the formulation to a lower global warming potential blowing agent, which involved a reduction in greenhouse gas emissions once that product was used. So a few years ahead. So we were able to count those climate benefits against their footprint. John Shegerian: Got you. Jeff Hansbro: And along with that – so you have the product and then you have an educational and contractor training program for the use of the product. It’s a product with a lower carbon embodied footprint itself. John Shegerian: Got you. Jeff Hansbro: And use of that as well as an education training program to support the implementation of it. Then, that ultimately brings awareness to Dow’s showcase technologies. John Shegerian: OK. So now the product itself, training and education to implementation. Jeff Hansbro: Correct. John Shegerian: Then how do you do then the other side of it – tracking of the success of it and then management of the success of it, obviously, and then tracking, and then creating data out of that? How does that work? Jeff Hansbro: So we have – it’s very important because the backend of it is key. John Shegerian: Yes. Jeff Hansbro: Instead of just leaving the legacy piece, which is very important for us as well for the Olympic movement to make sure that the legacy would be there. So we have two third-party firms that we’ll work with, and one of those is environmental resources management, which on the backend helps us on the measurement and tracking piece of it so that we ensure that the climate benefits are actually being attained, the product is being used, it’s measured, the climate benefits are being attained and they’re being placed against the footprint. John Shegerian: How does this interrelate with what became part of our lexicon 10 years ago – carbon credits? How does what you’re doing tie back to carbon credits in terms of now measuring success, or is this a whole new standard that you’re really creating that sort of transcends the carbon credit vernacular that we got used to? Jeff Hansbro: We think it’s a whole new paradigm. John Shegerian: OK. Jeff Hansbro: Versus the carbon credit piece. John Shegerian: Got you. Jeff Hansbro: So at Dow we have a strong set of sustainability goes. We just launched our 2025 sustainability goals. John Shegerian: Wow. Jeff Hansbro: Prior to that we focused on our footprint, which was our own internal understanding, our baseline. Then we moved to our handprint, which is essentially how we help our customers to understand their baseline, their footprint and to use our technology to then consider mitigating their own footprint by the use of their end-use products. So that’s essentially what we’re doing here with our carbon framework is using our showcase technology in a region of deployment that is beneficial to the games. For Sochi, it was the greater Russia area. For Rio 2016, it will be the greater Latin America region. So you engage everyone in that community, including key customers that we might have or possible key customers that we might have. John Shegerian: Got you. Jeff Hansbro: So it’s not a science experiment and it’s definitely a revenue generator for us. John Shegerian: Right. So it really ties back to, again, one of the great themes I’m seeing, Jeff. We started the show seven or eight years ago, and back in 2005 and 2006, when you started talking to people about being green, there was always this push back of “Well, being green costs more money,” but here is another great example where sustainability really polishes and adds to your bottom line at Dow on every level. Jeff Hansbro: Yeah. John Shegerian: Both in terms of visibility, in terms of marketing, in terms of real client engagement and also getting new potential clients. Jeff Hansbro: Right. John Shegerian: So talk a little bit about mega events. If you’re doing these – you did Sochi, you’re going to do Rio. Does this also now get broken down into other sports events? We’re here at the Green Sports Alliance, obviously. Are you going to be bringing this to now stadium events in America? Is this also something for rock concerts? How does Dow then interrelate this into other sports venues in terms of what is going on just on the NBA, NFL, NHL and other sports? Jeff Hansbro: The leveraging of it is absolutely possible. John Shegerian: Got you. Jeff Hansbro: A key piece in the reason why it has worked well with the Olympic movement is because you first need – this is the preaching element of this conference here – John Shegerian: Sure. Jeff Hansbro: You first need to understand your footprint. John Shegerian: Got it. Jeff Hansbro: Then you need to take steps to reduce your footprint. John Shegerian: Got it. Jeff Hansbro: Show some motivation along the way to reduce your footprint. We’ve stated internally that if we’re going to develop a framework and institutionalize it for the Olympic movement, that there needs to be motivation internally for them to reduce their own footprint. John Shegerian: Got it. That makes sense. Jeff Hansbro: Otherwise, it’s not going to work for both of us. John Shegerian: That’s right. Jeff Hansbro: It has to be a partnership. If it’s a league, or if it’s a team, if they have an infrastructure project, depending on the size of the carbon footprint, I definitely think that this is very possible. John Shegerian: This is the way to go. Jeff Hansbro: This is the way to go to do it. Some of these – especially in the leagues – they have a nationwide fan base. John Shegerian: Sure. Jeff Hansbro: If it’s a team, some of the teams also have a nationwide fan base so this is a great way to engage your fan base in the environmental sustainability piece of what your team is doing. If you are a team of that specific fan, you can directly point to what they are doing and how we might [inaudible]. John Shegerian: That makes a lot of sense. If you just joined us now, we’ve got Jeff Hansbro. He is a Senior Technology and Sustainability Leader at Dow Olympic and Sports Solutions. To learn more about what is going on at Dow in sustainability, please go to www.Dow.com. And to learn more about the Green Sports Alliance, please go to www.GreenSportsAlliance.org. So talk about Brazil. How much planning, and what is going on in terms of boots on the ground, and how many people are now deployed to plan to make the Brazil Olympics in 2016 in Rio green and sustainable based upon what you’re doing with the framework? Jeff Hansbro: So quite a few people. We have offices in Rio as well as in Sao Paulo and that involves – you, basically, start seven years prior to the game. John Shegerian: Wow. Jeff Hansbro: And so for us, becoming a top sponsor in 2010 but being very involved in the Olympic movement prior to that, this is a buildup of events. I mentioned the understanding of the measurement of their footprint. John Shegerian: Sure. Jeff Hansbro: A lot of discussions back and forth on key technologies that we would use for the mitigation of their footprint. John Shegerian: Sure. Jeff Hansbro: In Rio, what we found is it’s regionally very different than Sochi. Brazil, as a whole, uses a lot of hydroelectric power. John Shegerian: Right. Jeff Hansbro: That was not the case in Sochi. So you need to find different technologies, and we have a technology base that supports that that will resonate with the Olympic movement as well as work in that economy, and that can make a difference. So sustainable farming, sustainable agriculture, lower density micro foaming of films are a few of the programs that we are considering. John Shegerian: So talk about that. You just brought up a fascinating point, Jeff. How long in advance did you start working on Rio? Jeff Hansbro: In Rio, we essentially started back in 2012, 2013 to work with Rio. John Shegerian: Wow. And how many boots on the ground do you have actually in Brazil working on it? Jeff Hansbro: Directly in our business I would say 10. John Shegerian: Wow. Jeff Hansbro: But the bigger piece of that is the Dow office and the Dow support that we have there. John Shegerian: Exactly. Jeff Hansbro: We in Olympic and Sports Solutions are sort of a niche, very small business. John Shegerian: We have a lot of visibility, though. Jeff Hansbro: Exactly. I should not use the word niche. John Shegerian: No. Jeff Hansbro: Because sometimes there is not a lot of longevity to that. John Shegerian: Right. Jeff Hansbro: So I’ll speak for myself here. We have a lot of visibility – you are correct – that goes along with that. John Shegerian: Yeah. Jeff Hansbro: But our mission as a business within Dow is to be the bridge of science and technology to the other top 11 business units that actually supply products. John Shegerian: Wow. Jeff Hansbro: So when you ask about boots on the ground and how many are engaged, we are a small core group but then we have- John Shegerian: Everyone is engaged. Jeff Hansbro: Everyone in that region. And then globally. John Shegerian: Globally. Jeff Hansbro: The Olympic movement is global, so globally to support that. John Shegerian: In terms of before you were involved with Dow Olympic and Sports Solutions and started applying your knowledge to sustainability, how much was sustainability a big deal at Dow before this division got really launched and got all the traction that you’ve got going now? Jeff Hansbro: It has been a gradual movement. It’s been – people define sustainability many different ways. John Shegerian: It’s a journey. Jeff Hansbro: Right. So I think in different businesses depending on if it was our building solutions business, which actually supplies a branded product to the consumer, there is a different approach in how they would approach sustainability. You have tangible projects that you can work on to supply insulation and air sealing to those business units. John Shegerian: Right. Jeff Hansbro: If you’re an ingredient piece, such as our Dow coating materials business – we’re the largest acrylic supplier in the world to major paint and coating manufacturer. John Shegerian: Wow. Jeff Hansbro: So the sustainability piece there is built more off of understanding lifecycle analysis of how that specific ingredient plays in a total formulation and then how it would be used on a product. John Shegerian: Wow. Jeff Hansbro: So from business to business, the sustainability piece is different. And then I mean Dow has done a great job overall starting back in 1995 formally to outline 10-year sustainability goals and – as I mentioned earlier – focusing on the footprint and just getting an understanding of this massive engine of operations and how you would define what our footprint is. You need to start there. John Shegerian: Talk a little bit about GSA. How long has Dow been involved with Green Sports Alliance, and what are you actually going to be doing at the conference in terms of messaging and other important issues here at the Green Sports Alliance? Jeff Hansbro: We have been involved with the GSA for a couple years now. John Shegerian: OK. Jeff Hansbro: This is our first year presenting as well as a sponsor, and we’re presenting on town hall – on carbon mitigation for large mega events. John Shegerian: Got you. And is it a panel or is it just you presenting? Jeff Hansbro: It’s a town hall discussion. John Shegerian: Right. Jeff Hansbro: Fernal Severa is our moderator, is our global public affairs leader, myself and then we have David Stubbs, who is an Independent Sustainability Expert who led the sustainability movement for the IOC for the London 2012 games. John Shegerian: Right. Jeff Hansbro: And then Eva Kassens-Noor, who is an Assistant Professor at Michigan State University, talking about urban transit and how you would realize urban transit in the process of designing a mega event. John Shegerian: Wow. Jeff Hansbro: Sustainable movement. Yep. John Shegerian: Wow. And you’re going to be speaking – when is the town hall? Jeff Hansbro: At 2:15. John Shegerian: Today? Jeff Hansbro: Yes. John Shegerian: Wow. That is exciting. So it is the first time you guys are presenting – that Dow is presenting at the Green Sports Alliance? Jeff Hansbro: Yes. John Shegerian: That is wonderful. Wonderful. And how often do you have to go down to Brazil in terms of managing the whole process of getting ready for Rio? Jeff Hansbro: I have yet to be down. John Shegerian: Wow. Coming soon. Jeff Hansbro: This is a part of our global team. John Shegerian: OK. Got you. Jeff Hansbro: And allowing them to do their work and focus on what they’re doing. John Shegerian: Got you. Jeff Hansbro: But at some point I’ll get down there. John Shegerian: Got you. Any final thoughts before we have to say goodbye today? Jeff Hansbro: What the Green Sports Alliance is doing here is a phenomenal thing. You have thought leaders from every different area. As I mentioned, 6,000 products that we have so we touch a lot of different folks in the so-called value chain, the sustainability value chain. This short two- to three-day event gives us the perfect opportunity to come here and network and understand what our peers are doing as well as network connections and who we might possibly work with next. John Shegerian: Exactly. Well, thank you for your time today, Jeff. This is really good and we wish you luck in Rio 2016. Another great success story like you had in Sochi. Jeff Hansbro: Thank you, John. John Shegerian: Great. For our listeners and viewers out there, this has been the Green Sports Alliance edition of Green Is Good, and we have Jeff Hansbro with us today, and Jeff told the whole story about Dow Olympic and Sports Solutions. To learn more about everything at Dow Olympic and Sports Solutions please, go to www.Dow.com. Jeff Hansbro, making the world a better place. You are truly living proof that Green Is Good. Thank you so much. Jeff Hansbro: Thanks a lot, John.

John Shegerian: Welcome to another edition of Green Is Good. This is the Green Sports Alliance edition of Green Is Good, and we are here in beautiful downtown Chicago, and we’ve got Joe Khirallah with us. He is the founder and the owner of the Green Bear Group. Welcome to Green Is Good. Joe Khirallah: It’s a pleasure to be here. That is also one of our taglines, if you look on the back of my card. John Shegerian: Wait a second. Joe Khirallah: “Green is good.” John Shegerian: “Green is good” on the back of this card right here. I love that. This is it. You should be on our show more often. I think we’re going to start making you a regular. So, Joe, before we get talking about the Green Bear Group, talk a little bit about Joe Khirallah. What was your journey leading up to this? Before founding Green Bear Group, were you a greenie from birth or is this something that happened along the way? Joe Khirallah: No. It was an epiphany. I turned 40. I had been in marketing and communications for 20-plus years, and I woke up one day and I said, “OK, this is great. But I’m next to the fire. I need to get in the fire.” John Shegerian: I like that. Joe Khirallah: So I got a couple of colleagues, we founded Green Bear in 2009, and shortly thereafterwards, I met Scott Jenkins from the Seattle Mariners. John Shegerian: And that was it. Joe Khirallah: And that was it. John Shegerian: And you started working with the Mariners? Joe Khirallah: We did. We started working with the Mariners. We helped them get together with BASF, their big sponsor. We helped them create Sustainable Saturdays, their fan engagement program. John Shegerian: Wow. Joe Khirallah: And very shortly afterwards, Scott reached out and put his hand on my shoulder and said, “Do you do any pro bono work?” so naturally we said, “Sure.” The four founders, we’re all huge sports fans. John Shegerian: Got you. Joe Khirallah: We love this space. John Shegerian: Right. Joe Khirallah: And it’s the right thing to do, so we said, “Sure.” So we’ve been with them. We helped them launch back in March in 2011. John Shegerian: That’s the GSA? Joe Khirallah: Yes. John Shegerian: Got you. Joe Khirallah: And we helped them with communications strategy, with PR, with video work, and now I’m an advisor to the board. John Shegerian: Great. So now let’s talk about Green Bear. Joe Khirallah: Sure. John Shegerian: So you’re an entrepreneur – an ecopreneur – by founding Green Bear Group. So you have four partners? Joe Khirallah: Yes. John Shegerian: You’re all in northern California. Joe Khirallah: No, we are virtual. I’ve got one in North Hollywood. Sean is in North Hollywood – our creative director. John Shegerian: OK. Joe Khirallah: I’ve got one in Sausalito – our clean tech director – myself in Redwood City and another partner here in Chicago. John Shegerian: And that is really how companies run now, right? Joe Khirallah: Yes. John Shegerian: They are virtual. You don’t have to all sit under one roof every day at a desk. Joe Khirallah: As long as we’re near high speed internet and an airport…. John Shegerian: The company is up and running. Joe Khirallah: Right. John Shegerian: That’s great. Talk a little bit about the formation. You talked about your first client. Talk about the journey. Where are you now? Joe Khirallah: Sure. Well, for us, it all comes down to three things: connecting people and then building relationships and then helping them tell their stories. John Shegerian: Wow. Joe Khirallah: OK. So that’s how we approach everything is, who do we know, who do they need to work with, help them come together, make sure their values are aligned. We’ll do facilitation to ideate around the strategic objectives of both organizations. Once they’re in line we help them, come up with campaigns to work together and tell those stories to the public. John Shegerian: So you founded this in 2009 – Green Bear? Joe Khirallah: Yes. John Shegerian: And for our listeners and viewers out there, to find Joe and his partners at Green Bear Group, go to www.GreenBearGroup.com. Talk a little bit about the journey. Is the journey a straight line? Have you landed a lot – I mean, the crash came in 2009 and 2010? Joe Khirallah: Right. That’s when we started. Great time to start a new company. John Shegerian: Well, you know, sometimes the contrarians of this world – I mean, right? Joe Khirallah: You know, the way I looked at it was, “OK I feel this in here.” John Shegerian: Yup. Joe Khirallah: I’ve got to act on it now, and yeah sure, it might not be the best time to start a company, but on the other hand it might be because you can only go up in that economy, right? John Shegerian: Right. Great point. Joe Khirallah: And so we were fortunate to meet up with the Mariners and help them get together with BASF, did a lot of work with the Green Sports Alliance over the years and now BASF has become a regular customer over the years. Now we’re helping them with the New York Yankees. John Shegerian: Wow. Joe Khirallah: So talk about a journey going from small market team to the biggest brand in America ostensibly. John Shegerian: Maybe the world in terms of baseball. Joe Khirallah: Certainly the world in terms of baseball. In top two or three. Maybe Manchester United. John Shegerian: Right. Joe Khirallah: New York Yankees. Dallas Cowboys. John Shegerian: Right. Joe Khirallah: Right. John Shegerian: Those three brands. Joe Khirallah: And what we’re helping them do is BASF cares a lot about sustainability and they bring it together into sports in a variety of ways so they want to help tell that story and help the sports teams and venues actually improve what they’re doing. John Shegerian: Wow. Joe Khirallah: Improve their zero waste, which is a big concern of theirs, through a lot of their products that become into compostable bags. Improve compostable packaging. They have a prototype that we helped them come out and advertise – the Compostable Peanut Bag Day in Seattle. So now can’t really divulge what is coming up with the Yankees this year, but it’s a big deal. It will be a huge contest so if any of your viewers are in the New York area, tell them to please check out the Yankees’ site and keep your eyes peeled. John Shegerian: When? When do they check it out? Joe Khirallah: The big launch will be July 17. John Shegerian: After July 17, check out the Yankees’ site. Joe Khirallah: And it’s going to be a contest, Instagram-based. They will be able to win some cool prizes and it will be for a couple months long. John Shegerian: All created by the Green Bear Group. Joe Khirallah: And BASF and the Yankees together with MLBAM, all-around finding the most sustainable Yankees family. John Shegerian: Wow. That’s really cool. Joe Khirallah: It’s really exciting. We’re happy to be there. John Shegerian: And does that Yankees family have to be in New York or it could be anywhere? Joe Khirallah: It can be anywhere because it’s online. John Shegerian: They’ve got fans around the world. Joe Khirallah: They do. Yeah. John Shegerian: Wow. Talk a little bit about your business enterprise. How has it grown over the years? Is it all sports-based, or is it also now way beyond sports? Joe Khirallah: We started with the premise of we wanted to help mitigate climate change. John Shegerian: OK. Joe Khirallah: And then we landed in sports and we love sports so we’re continuing to grow that. We have worked with a variety of teams, and we’re talking to many more right now. In addition, we realized in the last couple of years sustainability isn’t just about the environment – though, it is here. John Shegerian: Right. Joe Khirallah: Even in the Green Sports Alliance, the mission has now expanded broader beyond ecological into social, into health and wellness, into the food. John Shegerian: Absolutely. Joe Khirallah: You’ve talked to some folks about that here. So that is the vision. We have specializations in food, high tech, clean tech and sports and sustainability. John Shegerian: So your business is exploding. Joe Khirallah: Yes. John Shegerian: Wow. Five years. Joe Khirallah: Five years. The first two, slow growth. John Shegerian: That’s right. Joe Khirallah: But sort of a hockey stick. John Shegerian: With the trend in sustainability being there is no going back, the genie is out of the bottle, obviously – as you say – and that has led into better eating, cleaner eating, vegetarianism, veganism. All are part of our lexicon now. How many doors are opened for you in terms of getting good green messaging out to getting sustainable messaging out there, and how do you go about finding business? Does business come to you now because you’ve grown such a great brand at Green Bear Group? Joe Khirallah: Mostly, yes now. John Shegerian: Right. Joe Khirallah: OK. It’s mostly referral now. But what we look at is we look at what is going on – like you said – trends in society. John Shegerian: Yeah. Joe Khirallah: Right now one of the big things in food – in addition to organic – is the whole clean and sustainably sourced but also local. John Shegerian: Yup. Joe Khirallah: To reduce the carbon footprint of having the thing transported. So we’re working with a small company right in Silicon Valley that is a two store farmers market chain, and they deal direct farm to their products so it’s almost farm-to-table. John Shegerian: Right. Joe Khirallah: And so they had a struggle. They were losing – they didn’t understand why they weren’t making profits and they were threatened because one of their big collaborators was Costco across the street. People tend to root shop. John Shegerian: Right. Joe Khirallah: They were closing for a year. So they were afraid no one was going to come to Segona’s anymore. John Shegerian: Whoa. Joe Khirallah: And we helped them for a year-and-a-half, and now the lessons that we’ve taught them – we’ve sort of taught them how to fish and helped them hire a person – so a year-and-a-half later their profits were up and now they’ve even launched a Fruit for Thought program out to corporate. So snacks, healthy snacks for corporate American offices. John Shegerian: Wow, that’s awesome. Joe Khirallah: So it’s just really rewarding. John Shegerian: And when someone hires Green Bear Group you do everything, soup to nuts – advertising, social media, offline analogue media, everything. Joe Khirallah: Yeah. We start with the understanding what are their values and what are the business objectives, so we usually facilitate a planning session upfront. John Shegerian: Right. Joe Khirallah: Then, go into – OK – what are your business goals around this campaign? What do you want to accomplish in the next six months? John Shegerian: Right. Joe Khirallah: Then we will go into defining some creative. Once they choose that, we’ll help execute it or activate it. John Shegerian: And so it could be a brand-new brand or it could be an 80-year-old brand. Joe Khirallah: Right. John Shegerian: You don’t mind. You work with startups and you work with legacy brands. Joe Khirallah: Yeah. Which is interesting because we tend to work a lot with very small companies, like startups and local businesses, and very large companies. John Shegerian: Wow. Joe Khirallah: We have something big at stake and they want to move into sustainability and build that brand or build their awareness that they’re already doing great sustainable work; it’s just people don’t necessarily know about it yet. John Shegerian: Joe, we’re down to a minute-and-a-half. You’re here at GSA again – fifth year. Joe Khirallah: Yeah. John Shegerian: What were you doing here? Were you speaking at this event? Joe Khirallah: Yeah. On Monday, we had the very first ever UPS global leadership council thought leadership forum, and I created the curriculum for that and facilitated; it was a three-hour workshop. John Shegerian: Wow. Joe Khirallah: The reason why that is important is because now the GSA for the first time is bringing corporate members in through this global leadership council so now we can help them more directly influence the supply chain to the sports industry to green that up, and what better way to do that than having them under the tent? John Shegerian: Love it. Joe Khirallah: As Allen said today, “We’re all one team.” John Shegerian: One team. It’s really true. And did you do any other speaking here? Joe Khirallah: No, that was the big one. John Shegerian: That was the big one. Joe Khirallah: Three hours on the – yeah. John Shegerian: Where is next year’s event? Has that been announced yet or not yet? Joe Khirallah: I thought it was going to be announced, but we had to hold off for a little bit. John Shegerian: OK. Got it. This is the biggest and best summit ever. Joe Khirallah: Yes. John Shegerian: Final thoughts to you. Joe Khirallah: OK. Final thoughts are, it is an important problem, it is an urgent situation and at the same time it’s all about sports here, right? John Shegerian: Right. Joe Khirallah: The cultural influence and power of sports. But you don’t work sports, you play sports. John Shegerian: It’s true. Joe Khirallah: So the way we look at it is, we have to take our work seriously but don’t take ourselves too seriously. If you play with it, and you get better ideas through creative playing, you will reach more people, you will touch them in their heart – and that is the way we like to do it. So at the end of the day, we’re doing good and we’re having fun while we’re doing it. John Shegerian: Do good, have fun, change the world. Joe Khirallah: There you go. John Shegerian: I love it. Joe Khirallah: Can I use that? John Shegerian: You can use that. Joe Khirallah: We’ll put that on our next business card. John Shegerian: I’d love it. Joe Khirallah – he is the owner, the founder and one of the four partners of the Green Bear Group. To find Joe and hire his group to help get the word out there on your company or organization, go to www.GreenBearGroup.com, and his tagline is “green is good.” So – man – we are so happy we had Joe on with us today. To find the Green Sports Alliance, go to www.GreenSportsAlliance.org. Joe Khirallah, you are making the world a better place and are truly living proof that Green Is Good. Thank you so much for your time today. Joe Khirallah: My pleasure. It’s an honor to be with you. John Shegerian: Thank you.

John Shegerian: Welcome to another edition of Green Is Good. This is the Green Sports Alliance edition of Green Is Good from downtown Chicago, and we’re so excited to have with us today Janette Micelli from Waste Management. Thank you for joining us today, Janette. Janette Micelli: Thank you for having me. John Shegerian: You know, Janette, you are the Manager of External Communications. Before we get talking about all the great work you’re doing at Waste Management with your colleagues, can you share with our viewers and our listeners a little bit about your own personal journey before joining Waste Management? Janette Micelli: Sure. So I’ve been in the PR/Marketing/Communications industry for about 18 years with a number of different industries. So higher education. NASCAR racing – even – at one point. John Shegerian: Whoa. Janette Micelli: If you believe that one. John Shegerian: That’s great. Janette Micelli: Solar and now Waste Management. John Shegerian: Wonderful. And how many years ago did you join Waste Management? Janette Micelli: Four years ago. John Shegerian: Four years ago. And so when you joined – and you are working as the Manager of External Communications. What does that mean, actually? Janette Micelli: So I actually support a number of different areas across the business on the corporate level, plus we also support the field. We actually have 17 areas. So primarily my focus is on the southern tier – Hawaii to Florida, the southern half of the U.S. John Shegerian: Wow. Janette Micelli: We are a North American company, though, however. Again, I have a colleague that supports the northern tier but my focus – I live in Arizona. John Shegerian: OK. Janette Micelli: Home of the Waste Management Phoenix Open, so I’ve been very blessed to work on that tournament. John Shegerian: Which we’re going to talk about. Janette Micelli: Yep. But recycling is another thing that I focus on. CNG – compressed natural gas – things around our fleet. John Shegerian: Wow. Janette Micelli: So a little bit of everything. We’re an innovative environmental solutions company and just – I mean it’s phenomenal the things that we’re doing. John Shegerian: So you’re never bored. Janette Micelli: No. I am never bored. John Shegerian: OK. For our listeners and viewers out there that want to learn more about all the great things that Waste Management is doing in sustainability and green, please go to www.WM.com or www.ThinkGreen.com. www.ThinkGreen.com is another great website. So you’re in Arizona and the Waste Management PGA Tour event that you put on down there has gotten to become a very iconic brand internationally. Talk a little bit about the advent of that, the launch of that great tournament and the evolution of that. Janette Micelli: So we just completed our sixth year as title sponsor, and in fact, in December, we announced we’re coming back for another 10. John Shegerian: Wow. Janette Micelli: Very excited. John Shegerian: Congratulations. Janette Micelli: I’m very excited about that. Absolutely. We started out – we looked at this tournament thinking here is this beautiful golf course – TPC Scottsdale – and you’re out in the environment and you can really appreciate the environment and all the beautiful trees and the flowers and the lakes so we look at the PGA Tour as a great way to engage. It’s environmental appreciation. We want to preserve that that we have. A lot of our customers and fans and followers like the game of golf so we really found it to be a great fit. John Shegerian: Talk a little bit about making it also a very visual event in terms of sustainability and showing how green it is in terms of there are no trashcans on the course and the other great things that you’ve done in green and sustainability to really show the world how green Waste Management is and all your sustainability efforts are. Janette Micelli: Yeah. So we came in and had your standard waste and recycling receptacles – fine – but as an environmental solutions company and somebody who is engaged as a resource to help businesses, to help campuses, to help communities green themselves, we said, “What better way than for us to be the zero-waste event?” John Shegerian: It’s amazing. Janette Micelli: So that’s when we went to recycling, compost, 6,000 containers across the course. John Shegerian: Wow. Janette Micelli: No trashcans. Of course, there is a lot of work that goes into that behind the scenes. John Shegerian: Sure. And so it’s a zero waste event, and it’s been zero waste since you started it? Janette Micelli: Actually, no. John Shegerian: The evolution. Janette Micelli: In 2012, we issued the zero waste challenge, and that really was having the fans engage with us and help them, educate them a little bit about the process. Obviously, this is an event that we engage practically three-quarters of a million people throughout the course of a week. John Shegerian: Amazing. Janette Micelli: In February, we just had 564,000 fans. John Shegerian: Besides 564,000 fans present, I watched the event on television now so it has becomes a worldwide television event. I was actually in Korea last time that your event was happening. Janette Micelli: Oh wow. John Shegerian: And not only was I watching it but the Koreans who love golf were all very attuned and paying very close attention and associating the event – of course – with Waste Management. It was big news in Korea. So how has the event grown for you as the Manager of External Communications not only as a North American event and iconic brand but an international platform now to continue to show all the great sustainability projects that you’re working on? Janette Micelli: We really engage with the fans who are there on course, but we realize that’s only a minor audience, right? John Shegerian: Right. Janette Micelli: You talk about this being a global event in nature. John Shegerian: Yeah. Janette Micelli: So we’re very cognizant of that. We work with all of the media partners that are promoting or broadcasting the tournament. We make sure that they’re equipped with all the great things that we’re doing kind of to bring those sustainable aspects from the tournament to them. In recent years, we’ve done time lapse footage to show the construction – say – of our zero-waste stations, which is our version of – believe it or not – a reused dumpster. We’ve converted a dumpster – I know it sounds crazy – into an interactive station to where fans can bring their materials to our volunteers, we can help them understand whether a material is recyclable or compostable, we can answer their questions about “what is all this zero waste stuff about,” and so we really enjoy that. Another thing that we do that’s very visual – obviously, our brand is important – on the 18th hole, we have a WM water feature. It’s a large WM – Waste Management – logo complete with the registered trademark filled with 140,000 used golf balls. John Shegerian: Wow. Janette Micelli: A fun innovative way, captures those cameras, right? John Shegerian: Right. Janette Micelli: So then everybody sees it. It actually turns slowly, and the fans really enjoy engaging with it. We’ve got birds that fly in and use it as a resting place, and it’s neat. John Shegerian: That is really cool. For our listeners and viewers that have just joined us, we’ve got Janette Micelli. She’s is the Manager of External Communications at Waste Management and to learn more about all the green and sustainable projects that Waste Management is working on, please go to www.WM.com or www.ThinkGreen.com. Water is very big to the golf world. Talk about what you do in terms of water conservation at your great event in Arizona. Janette Micelli: We’re certainly aware that we are operating a beautiful golf course – golf tournament – in the middle of a desert. John Shegerian: Right. Janette Micelli: Arizona. Certainly, there is a large conversation in the Southwest region – especially California with the drought conditions that they’re under – how can we get the word out about water? So I think that is something that we’ve actually – in the recent last year or so – really tried to pivot. People understand that this is a zero waste event. They’ve come to expect that. They understand there are no trash cans, they get the recycling, they get the compost. But with water we find creative ways to talk about the messaging. For instance, all of the concession areas, all the kitchens – the mobile kitchens that are set up onsite, preparing food for everyone – we actually recycle that water. We put them into our portalets instead of using fresh water. John Shegerian: Wow. Janette Micelli: Also, any fresh water we do have to consume, we work with the Bonneville Environmental Foundation and get water credits so it’s in essence offsetting any water use that we do. And this year we brought the – I guess “water experience,” if you will – to the fans. We partner with Change The Course and their whole campaign is about water restoration. And the greatest thing that we really liked about it is, they had active projects on northern Arizona’s Verde River plus the Colorado River Basin where people could simply just pledge to conserve water in their daily lives. They simply text “WMPO” to 77177 and then right away that was restoring water – 1,000 gallons, in fact, per pledge to the Verde and the Colorado River Basin. John Shegerian: Wow. Obviously, not only are you the Manager of External Communications and have all those southern states, but since you live in Arizona, I’m sure so much of the responsibility falls on your shoulders for the pre-planning. How many months in advance are you planning for this event, and how much does that really take of your mindshare and time? Janette Micelli: Absolutely. It’s virtually year round but probably active about 10 months. John Shegerian: Wow. Janette Micelli: And this is a team effort. John Shegerian: Right. Janette Micelli: There is no one person at Waste Management who is doing this alone. We’ve got a customer experience. We’ve got the operations team, who locally has to service that event, turn it around every night and make sure that golf course is just as beautiful as it was the day before. Sustainability services, they are huge in this and the reason is with a zero-waste event, you just can’t tell everybody to show up and we’re going to have a zero-waste event and expect it all to go well. There is tons of collaboration with all the vendors, making sure all the materials that they’re bringing in are recyclable, are compostable, or if we have a special waste stream that we need to deal with in the back-of-house, that we set up those bins for them. John Shegerian: That’s amazing. Janette Micelli: And, of course, they’re out there just following up as people arrive, as they activate. We engage with other sponsors, too, of the tournament. John Shegerian: Right. Janette Micelli: Teach them how they can have a more green sustainable event. John Shegerian: Janette, we’re here at the Green Sports Alliance. How many years has Waste Management been involved with GSA? Janette Micelli: We’ve been involved with GSA, actually, since the beginning as the Waste Management Phoenix Open and, certainly, as Waste Management here at the conference. We’re actually the zero-waste sponsor, so we are back-of-house. Our team is here. They’re back there, actually, sorting through the materials every night, making those weights, and all that will be reported through the conference. John Shegerian: That’s wonderful. So since the advent of the GSA, you’ve been involved with GSA? Janette Micelli: Absolutely. John Shegerian: Now you’re here also not only as the zero-waste sponsor, but you’re also a speaker. Talk a little bit about what you spoke about today at the conference. Janette Micelli: So I was on the “Engaging Millennials through Sustainability” panel, and there are several ways at the Waste Management Phoenix Open that we do, indeed, that – a big one is social media. We created a special hashtag for the tournament – #greenestshow – and not only was that “what do you think about the Waste Management Phoenix Open and your experience here or watching it from home?” but “How are you living a green life at home?” “What are you doing at your home, your workplace, your business to be greener and more sustainable in general?” Those zero waste stations, another example of engaging those millennials. We have volunteer managers from local nonprofits that actually come and help us manage those. Practically, half of those managers were millennials. John Shegerian: It’s so interesting. Janette Micelli: And then out of all the volunteers we engaged throughout Tournament Week at the zero-waste stations, 40 percent of them were millennials. So they’re very active, they’re very engaged, they’re passionate about sustainability, and so it was great to be able to share some of the ways that we work with them. John Shegerian: You are the Manager of External Communications for the largest waste brand – environmental services brand – in the United States so when you guys take action it really moves the needle so it’s so exciting to hear all these things you’re doing. As we sign off today, and have to say goodbye, what are two or three things you want to leave with our listeners and our viewers about waste management and about your “Think Green” initiatives? Janette Micelli: We’re really looking at waste as a resource. Where is the value that we can get out of it? How can we do more with it? Forward innovative thinking things. What’s going to be the next thing? Certainly, landfills are just a part of the world we exist in and we’re happy to operate safe compliant landfills. Those facilities are key, are drivers, are great ambassadors for the company. And on the diesel side of things, we understand we have a lot of trucks, but we are aggressively moving towards compressed natural gas trucks to lower our footprint. Ninety percent of our new truck purchases are indeed CNG. So there are things that we are doing as a fleet and as a company to move the needle as well. John Shegerian: That is so great. Well, we hope you get to come back on the show and share the journey of sustainability and being green at Waste Management. There is no finish line – as you and I both know – but you’re working on so many fascinating projects and the great event that you have in Arizona every year. We’d love to continue to cover that and give you a platform to share this with the greater world so thank you so much for taking the time today, Janette. We really appreciate it. Janette Micelli: And thank you for your leadership. John Shegerian: For our listeners and our viewers out there, to learn more about what Janette and her great colleagues at Waste Management are doing to make the world a better place and a greener place, please go to www.WM.com or www.ThinkGreen.com. Janette Micelli, we think “green” when we think of you, we think “green” when we think of Waste Management. Thank you for being with us today, and you are truly living proof that Green Is Good. Thanks again. Janette Micelli: Thank you.

John Shegerian: This is the Green Sports Alliance edition of Green Is Good here in beautiful downtown Chicago, and we’ve got with us Jason Twill. Jason is a very special guest today because he is the co-founder of the Green Sports Alliance. Welcome to Green Is Good, Jason. Jason Twill: Thank you very much. John Shegerian: So you want to talk – this is a big – this is the first time we’ve had you on the show. Can you share the story of co-founding the Green Sports Alliance? Jason Twill: So I was working for an amazing and innovative firm called “Vulcan Ink” that was founded by Paul G. Allen, who was the co-founder of Microsoft, based in Seattle. Primarily, my background is in real estate development. I was working on a large scale urban development project called “Southlake Union” with Vulcan Real Estate. An anchor tenant of that community is www.Amazon.com. John Shegerian: Great. Jason Twill: And in 2008 when the market took a dive, I had an opportunity to rethink my role a little bit and be in a position to look at other areas of innovation that we could look at in Paul’s portfolio. And Paul is a very visionary leader and has a very deep passion for art, science, museums, culture, sports and music. So he has the Experience Music Project museum, he owns the Seattle Sounders FC, the Seahawks, the Portland Trailblazers, and I had an epiphany one day to kind of walk across the street – our office is right across from CenturyLink Field – introduced myself to Darryl Benge, who was then the Operations Head for CenturyLink Field, and just struck up a conversation about some of the opportunities around sustainability we could look at at the venue as far as renewable energy, energy efficiency. And that team was already thinking about these things. It had looked at some opportunities to change lighting, reduce water footprint. They had a really robust recycling and composting program. In Seattle, they do that. It’s in the culture. It’s in the Kool-Aid there. John Shegerian: Right. Jason Twill: And this kind of dialogue ensued, and we connected with Justin Zeulner, who was at the Trailblazers, and they were getting their facility LEED-certified so it was already this ripe opportunity kind of sitting there. It was fertile. John Shegerian: Right. Jason Twill: People were thinking about opportunities to green venues. And we started a conversation with Scott Jenkins across the street, and he was managing Safeco Field, and as we were conceiving doing a major solar project at CenturyLink Field – almost a megawatt of solar we put up – just sharing how we did that with them and just being more collaborative on the green. Even though we compete on the field, we can collaborate on changing the way we build these stadiums in our cities. John Shegerian: Right. Jason Twill: And about end of 2009 – it was about November or December – my boss who actually led and built – his name was Ray Colliver – built the CenturyLink Field, originally it was Qwest Field when it was built, gave me a copy of a Sports Business Journal and the focus of that was looking at stadiums that were looking at solar renewable energy on stadiums. John Shegerian: Oh. Jason Twill: And in the article I read, there was a guy named Allen Hershkowitz quoted. And I remember when we were talking about collaborating around sustainability in sport, the NRDC – Natural Resource Defense Council – had this kind of sports greening program, and I heard about this guy. But this article kind of was like, “Oh, that’s him. I need to call this guy.” So I kind of Googled him, got the phone number, called him up, introduced myself and said, “I work with this company. We have three sports franchises under Paul Allen’s leadership out here. We’re looking to collaborate around what we can do, go beyond where we are today in sustainability,” and invited him out and he jumped at the opportunity. And on February 1, 2010, we hosted a workshop at CenturyLink Field – actually, in the McCormick Suite. Ironic that we are at McCormick Convention Center today. John Shegerian: That’s great. Jason Twill: And in the weeks prior to that, I worked with some instrumental thinkers on mapping out a mission statement and what the possibilities could be to collaborate with sports teams. And we had five teams. We had the Seattle Storm, female WNBA team. John Shegerian: Right. Jason Twill: The Portland Trailblazers basketball team, NBA. The Seattle Seahawks, NFL team. Seattle Sounders, MLS team. The MLB Safeco, the Seattle Mariners. John Shegerian: Right. Jason Twill: And then about a month afterward, we invited the Vancouver Canucks. So, basically, the Northwest teams in professional sports helped really create this. They seeded a little bit of money. We had a very generous donation from Dennis Hayes and the Bullitt Foundation to seed fund the kind of funding to get like a staff member and get this thing off the ground. Then it was just a lot of roll up the sleeves, volunteer, biweekly calls to kind of start incubating, getting words out. But I think the power of it is the nature of being able to share information across venue operators so the venue operators are really the champions of starting this. So then Darryl Benge, Scott Jenkins, Justin Zeulner communicating with their counterparts at other venues across the country really set a chain of events off that really led to its evolving and growth as it has done over the last few years which has been absolutely astounding to watch. John Shegerian: We are five years into it now – or so. Is this where you expected it to be or has it exceeded your expectations and your vision? Where are we at compared to where you thought we’d be? Jason Twill: I would say it has absolutely exceeded expectations. But I’m not surprised. I think after about eight months of nurturing it, we knew we hit a nerve. John Shegerian: Got you. Jason Twill: And we knew that when we held the first summit in Portland in 2011. John Shegerian: Right. Jason Twill: That we were able to kind of muster together on a shoestring budget and get about 250 people out to Portland with mayors like Kevin Johnson. John Shegerian: Right. Jason Twill: And some pretty amazing leadership in the sports industry. And the conversation and energy of that event – just having an opportunity and a space for people to come to and talk about sustainability specific to the sports industry we knew we hit something and it just – there has been exponential growth since then. John Shegerian: Got you. And how long did you stay with it until you moved on to – your career evolved? Jason Twill: My career has always been a little but separate. So I mentioned onstage this morning, my day job – I’ve been waiting for my day job to align with this so it’s kind of an anomaly. My first love is cities and reimagining cities is kind of my fulltime role with Lendlease. John Shegerian: Got you. Jason Twill: And Lendlease is a 63-year-old firm headquartered and was founded in Australia by an amazing Dutch visionary named Dick Dusseldorp, and we are now led by a visionary CEO named Steve McCann, and we have a very strategic focus on cities, urban regeneration. If you look at sports and entertainment districts as catalysts for kind of changing the way we look at cities. John Shegerian: That is so interesting. Jason Twill: And where the conversation has gone as far as stadiums being out in the suburbs with oceans of parking lots and now really being part of the urban fabric, being downtown, creating walkable vibrant more dense districts and a lot of mixed uses around entertainment, housing, commercial office, retail offerings to really drive the livability for cities. I mean, cities around the world are fighting for capital and talent and the more vitality, livability and distinctiveness – and sports can play a major role in that. John Shegerian: So is that where Lendlease intersects with the Green Sports Alliance? Jason Twill: I think there is potential for that. It’s nascent. That conversation was first had this morning on a panel. John Shegerian: Got you. Jason Twill: Which is why I’m kind of excited about it. John Shegerian: Which is why you’re here. Jason Twill: Yeah. John Shegerian: And so how is it to come back home – so to speak – to the United States to the Green Sports Alliance, which you co-founded, and to be here, see all the amazing panels, see all the people? Jason Twill: It’s fantastic. John Shegerian: Is it just. Jason Twill: So I’m never that far. So I’m on the phone with Allen and Scott twice a week. So I am on the Executive Committee. John Shegerian: Right. Jason Twill: Immediate past Chair of the Board. So I am heavily involved in continuing to see this incubate and evolve. John Shegerian: And push it. You’re still pushing it. Jason Twill: We’re pushing it, and we’re actually expanding beyond the North American boundaries. We have a close friend – Shelia Nguyen – that has just launched the Sports Environment Alliance in Australia. John Shegerian: Wow. Jason Twill: We just had an international summit two days ago. So we have the Green Sports Alliance Europe, the Green Sports Alliance United Kingdom, we’re talking to South America so it’s now becoming a global movement. John Shegerian: This is amazing. Jason Twill: And the power behind it and the – if I think back to the original, the essence of why we wanted to do this, it’s how sports and athletes can really change the dialogue and discourse around the sustainability movement, take it away from politicians, take it away from – I guess – the sustainability practitioners and really get to the broader public on painting the vision for what kind of world we want to have for our children. John Shegerian: Five years into it. You’re the co-founder. Are we still just at the top of the second inning here? Jason Twill: Yeah. I think if you kind of humanize the sustainability movement, I think it has come out of its rambunctious adolescence, but we’re still teenagers trying to figure out what we’re going to be when we grow up. John Shegerian: That’s awesome. Jason Twill: But it’s not a fad. I think we are well aware of that. There are some systemic changes happening around the world, and there are a lot of mindsets being changed around this topic and how we’re going to address it. And there is a lot of strong leadership within government and outside of government to really make change, and I think – I have been thoroughly impressed with the – these are nonconventional relationships from where my career is, meeting people in the sports industry and the type of leaders like Gary Bettman in the NHL and all the commissioners – Bud Selig – and how outspoken and articulate they are at addressing environmental issues within their league and within – they understand the influence they have and they know the responsibility they have, and it has just been so inspiring to see that type of leadership happen. John Shegerian: That’s awesome. Well, thank you for spending time. This has been an honor to interview you here today. Jason Twill: Thank you. John Shegerian: Because Allen came on the show back around 2011 or so or 2012 and started sharing the journey of the Green Sports Alliance, so we have been following it very closely. We are honored to be here today – obviously – to interview so many of your panelists and speakers but even more honored to have you on to share the journey of co-founding to where we are today and some vision of the future. We wish you continued success driving the future of the Green Sports Alliance. Jason Twill: Thank you very much. I am honored to be part of it and you today. John Shegerian: Thank you. And for our listeners and our viewers out there – first – to find Jason he is over at Lendlease. You can find Jason Twill at www.Lendlease.com. Of course to find the Green Sports Alliance, please go to www.GreenSportsAlliance.org. This is John Shegerian and Jason Twill. We are here in downtown Chicago at the Green Sports Alliance edition of Green Is Good. Jason, obviously, you’re making the world a better place and you are truly living proof that Green Is Good. Thank you so much for being with us today. Jason Twill: Thank you very much. John Shegerian: Thank you.

John Shegerian: Welcome to another edition of Green Is Good. This is the Green Sports Alliance edition of Green Is Good in beautiful downtown Chicago. We are so honored to have with us today Charlene Wall-Warren. She is the Sustainability Director for BASF. Welcome to Green Is Good, Charlene. Charlene Wall-Warren: Thank you. John Shegerian: Before we get talking about all the great green and sustainable things you’re doing as BASF, I want you to please share your own journey. How did you even come to this place professionally and personally, where you have become the sustainability director at BASF? What was your journey like in terms of green? Charlene Wall-Warren: I’d love to. So I started as a chemical engineer working for BASF. John Shegerian: OK. Charlene Wall-Warren: Basically, doing project design, process design and for about 10 years. So I said, “So it’s really great to design pumps and equipment and make stuff.” John Shegerian: Right. Charlene Wall-Warren: “But I want to know where it goes. I want to know what happens to it.” I’m a bit of a geek so I like to know kind of what’s in the car, what’s in the furniture, what’s in the clothing, etc. John Shegerian: Got you. Charlene Wall-Warren: So about 15 years ago, BASF started a lifecycle assessment group, so we actually measure and quantify sustainability. It was a brand new job in North America and coming in as an engineer I said, “I think I can do this. It’s numerical, it’s quantitative, it’s cool. You’re looking at environmental and social” and once I tried that I got hooked. John Shegerian: Got you. And how long have you been the sustainability director there? Charlene Wall-Warren: I’ve been the Director of Sustainability for about two years now. John Shegerian: Got you. So you worked your way up. You are now the Director of Sustainability. Talk a little bit about – for our listeners that don’t know BASF – and our listeners and viewers who haven’t heard or want to learn more about BASF, please go to www.BASF.com. What is the mission and what does BASF do? Charlene Wall-Warren: So BASF is the largest chemical company in the world. John Shegerian: Wow. Charlene Wall-Warren: We have 110,000 people working around the world, €75 billion of sales and over 380 manufacturing facilities. But those are the numbers. John Shegerian: OK. Charlene Wall-Warren: We have a company purpose that is we create chemistry for a sustainable future. John Shegerian: Got you. Charlene Wall-Warren: So it’s a really interesting place to work because we’re making chemistry and science that goes into everything from houses to cars to pharmaceuticals to vitamins. We have natural and we have fossil-based products. And it’s all about creating chemistry for a sustainable future, so you get to learn how lots of stuff is made and you get to learn how everything could be made better. John Shegerian: Wow. So what were the – coming in to be the director of sustainability, what were some of the opportunities? Given that you became a lifecycle geek, what were some of the low hanging fruit, or “fruit on the floor,” let’s just say, that you were excited about tackling when you came in two years ago, and how has that journey gone? Charlene Wall-Warren: So I would say one of the things we’ve been really good at for a long time – low hanging fruit. John Shegerian: Yeah. Charlene Wall-Warren: Is operational excellence. John Shegerian: OK. Charlene Wall-Warren: So a lot of companies are talking about greening their operations. John Shegerian: Yeah. Charlene Wall-Warren: How do we use less energy? How do we generate less waste? John Shegerian: Right. Charlene Wall-Warren: Use less resources? And we have something called “Verbund” – so we are a German-headquartered company. John Shegerian: Right. Charlene Wall-Warren: And it’s all about taking the byproduct from one process and using it more efficiently in another process. So that was kind of the low hanging fruit. John Shegerian: Right. Charlene Wall-Warren: The really cool stuff, though, is when you get out into the marketplace and you kind of look at what is going on in the building space or fuel efficiency and hybrids for vehicles. John Shegerian: Right. Charlene Wall-Warren: And those are the areas – I think – where people often don’t appreciate what chemistry can bring and that is the really cool stuff. John Shegerian: Well, so you have all these people around the world and buildings and also all these amazing products. Where do you start? I mean, it sounds so daunting in terms of coming in as a director of sustainability. Where do you start? Where did you start your journey? Where did you choose to start, and how is it going? And talk a little bit about then engaging with GSA, then coming here today, too. So before we get talking about GSA – where did you start and where are you in your journey in sustainability at BASF? Charlene Wall-Warren: Sure. Yeah. So in my particular role- John Shegerian: Yeah. Charlene Wall-Warren: When we started, we were working with a group called “The Sustainability Consortium.” John Shegerian: OK. Charlene Wall-Warren: And those are consumer goods. John Shegerian: OK. Charlene Wall-Warren: So if you think of big retailers and kind of the products you and I might go to the store and buy- John Shegerian: Yes. Charlene Wall-Warren: There was really an interest in how could we make those products more sustainable – smaller footprint, less energy, less water, better toxicity aspects – and so that was kind of where we started. John Shegerian: OK. Charlene Wall-Warren: What landed us in the Green Sports Alliance and the sports space is because it’s about way more than just those kinds of products we may buy off the shelf. John Shegerian: Right. Charlene Wall-Warren: If you think about the stadium environment, I think about what is the stadium built out of? Are the products durable? Is it energy efficient? What is happening in the stadium? Are they managing food and food waste? Are they managing waste coming out of the stadium? Are they composting and recycling? All those kinds of things. And chemistry plays a role in each and every one of those areas. John Shegerian: Wow. So how many years has BASF been involved with the Green Sports Alliance? Charlene Wall-Warren: So we are, actually, this year part of their leadership council. John Shegerian: Right. Charlene Wall-Warren: And it’s a relatively new relationship for us, but it builds on over five years of work where we started out with the Seattle Mariners Safeco Field. John Shegerian: Right. Charlene Wall-Warren: Working with them on their zero-waste goals about five years ago. John Shegerian: Got you. So you started – so BASF saw the opportunity in sports and entertainment and got involved back then, and now you’re taking this leadership role with other global leaders. Charlene Wall-Warren: Yeah. Yeah, because for us it’s not about just putting a name up there. John Shegerian: Right. Charlene Wall-Warren: It’s really about saying, “We want to partner with a venue. We want to understand what their goals are.” John Shegerian: Right. Charlene Wall-Warren: We want to understand how chemistry can help them achieve their goals, and the most exciting thing – and this is, I think, for BASF, why we’re thrilled about this- John Shegerian: Good. Charlene Wall-Warren: We’re a science company. John Shegerian: Yeah. Charlene Wall-Warren: And if you look at the average person out there 70 percent or so are interested in sports. John Shegerian: You’re right. Charlene Wall-Warren: And it’s a much lower percentage interested in science. John Shegerian: Great point. Charlene Wall-Warren: So it gives us a chance to go in. Fans are interested, they’re engaged, they’re passionate. You can kind of let them know what chemistry and science is all about and build more awareness when it comes to sustainability, so it’s a great space. John Shegerian: It’s a great platform for BASF then. Charlene Wall-Warren: Yeah. Exactly. John Shegerian: Wow. Talk a little bit about the culture of the company. You’ve been there now quite some time. How do you take all the great work you’re doing in sustainability and message it both ways and get engagement and get engagement from your employees, and then how do we appreciate – now that you’re getting involved with the sports industry – but how did I know that when you came in and you lowered the footprint of all your great consumer products, how has that messaging typically gone? So how do you message both ways – employee engagement and then consumer engagement? Charlene Wall-Warren: Yeah. Sure. So in the stadium what we actually do – we have done things like Sustainable Saturdays. John Shegerian: Oh. Charlene Wall-Warren: So we’ll actually partner – this is one of the things we did in Seattle – we’ll go in and say, “Let’s help teach the fans about composting and zero-waste” and things like that. John Shegerian: Cool. Charlene Wall-Warren: What we do internally – and this is also one of the most exciting things – is we actually leverage our BASF team – and we’re doing this with the New York Yankees this coming July. We’re saying, “Guys, come and join us. Let’s go to a game, and you can watch the game, and you can have a good time, but we’re going to make you work for a little bit and we’re going to ask you to help us just hand out some awareness and messages about sustainability, about zero waste,” and we get so much enthusiasm from the employees. I mean, I have had employees just reach out with an email and say, “Hey, wow, I saw BASF’s sustainability moment up there during the Yankees game.” John Shegerian: That’s awesome. Charlene Wall-Warren: That’s awesome. So people get really excited about it. John Shegerian: Wow. And it’s great for the fans and your consumer fans, and it’s great for your employees the same way. Charlene Wall-Warren: Absolutely. John Shegerian: Wow. That’s so great. Well, it looks like you have a long relationship in front of you with the GSA, obviously, because it’s great for – as you said – you get to take your core business science and platform it using sports, where more people are definitely interested. And it’s so nice to have a chance to interview you, and we would like you to come back on and keep sharing the journey as you continue growing all the sustainability efforts at BASF. Thank you so much for being with us today. Charlene Wall-Warren: Thank you. I’d love to. Appreciate it. John Shegerian: For our listeners and our viewers out there, you’ve been enjoying Charlene Wall-Warren. She is the Director of Sustainability for BASF. To learn more about what Charlene and all her colleagues are doing in green and sustainability at BASF, please go to www.BASF.com. To learn more about the Green Sports Alliance, please go to www.GreenSportsAlliance.org. We thank you for being with us today, Charlene. Thank you for doing all the great work you do with BASF. You are making the world a better place. You are truly living proof that Green Is Good.

John Shegerian: Welcome back to Green Is Good. This is the Green Sports Alliance edition of Green Is Good here in beautiful downtown Chicago, and we are so honored to have with us today Professor Eva Kassens-Noor. She is going to be talking about climate in sports. Welcome to Green Is Good.

Eva Kassens-Noor: Thank you.

John Shegerian: You know, Eva, you are the Assistant Professor at Michigan State in Urban Transportation Planning in the School of Planning, Design and Construction.

Eva Kassens-Noor: That’s right.

John Shegerian: Plus, you’ve also been named-

Eva Kassens-Noor: I’m also joint appointed in the global urban studies program.

John Shegerian: Wow. So that is a mouthful, but you are doing a lot of great stuff there.

Eva Kassens-Noor: Thank you.

John Shegerian: And you are here today at the Green Sports Alliance to talk about climate and sports and the interrelationship. And you have a website, if people want to find you, called www.MegaEventPlanning.org. So today you are here at the Green Sports Alliance. Before we get talking about sports and climate, talk a little bit about you. Talk a little bit about Eva Kassens-Noor. Talk a little bit about your journey. Was this something that you grew up with? Were you green in your household or is something you learned about in college? Where did you get this excitement and energy about sustainability?

Eva Kassens-Noor: Well, I was born and raised in Germany.

John Shegerian: OK.

Eva Kassens-Noor: And then my mental consciousness in sustainability is a very strong part with which you are getting raised there. Recycling came very early in our household. I think at one point we had six or seven trashcans. It was quite daunting. Then, besides that, I always loved sports so as I was getting older and joining different leagues, I had the chance to go to the Atlanta 1996 Olympics.

John Shegerian: Really?

Eva Kassens-Noor: Yes.

John Shegerian: And so what happened there?

Eva Kassens-Noor: Well, I had a fantastic time – of course – seeing athletes compete and all with in the background thinking about, “OK, what can the city do to sustain this excitement or sustain more than just an Olympic Games? What can this mega event be a beacon for?”

John Shegerian: Right. Got you. So how did that evolve to where you are today?

Eva Kassens-Noor: Well, then I wanted to become a professor at one point. I think I was 21 when I figured out there is more to being a teacher, moving on to professor and becoming independent, setting your own research agenda and all I had to do – so a friend of mine say – or let’s say an advisor said, “All you have to do is get good grades,” so I was trying to do that and ultimately ended up now being a professor focusing on mega event planning and sustainability.

John Shegerian: That’s wonderful. And so when did you learn about the Green Sports Alliance?

Eva Kassens-Noor: It was basically in conversations that I had with Dow about mega events in general.

John Shegerian: Got you.

Eva Kassens-Noor: They started asking – because also I teach sustainability and climate resilient cities classes so I am primarily working on urban planning.

John Shegerian: OK.

Eva Kassens-Noor: And they said, “How would you be interested in joining us for a panel at the summit?” and I said yes.

John Shegerian: Perfect. And so what are you going to be talking about at the panel?

Eva Kassens-Noor: We will be discussing in which ways mega events can incorporate sustainability and we’ll focus on carbon so we’re looking at carbon reduction. We will be asking challenging questions whether there will ever be an option to have a carbon neutral event. If so, when would that be? Is that possible at all, and if so, how? And we’ll be talking about it from different perspectives. So my perspective will be from academia looking at what has been published to date so far, how have these mega events like Olympic Games or World Cups managed to incorporate sustainability, or if they have done that at all.

John Shegerian: Right.

Eva Kassens-Noor: The big question.

John Shegerian: Talk a little bit about your students at Michigan State. Are they on fire for green? Is the generation behind you really all excited about sustainability and green?

Eva Kassens-Noor: So the students at Michigan State – those who take the class – they are bleeding green.

John Shegerian: That’s wonderful.

Eva Kassens-Noor: They really want to learn, and they want to move forward, and they’re very, very excited. They are great students.

John Shegerian: So there is a big sustainability movement underfoot with the next generation, with the millennials.

Eva Kassens-Noor: Yes.

John Shegerian: Got you.

John Shegerian: So do you see – from an academia standpoint, is reduction of carbon footprint one of the ways that we could green mega events? Is it proven to work, and do you believe we are moving towards carbon neutrality at mega events?

Eva Kassens-Noor: I think we have a really long way to go to get there.

John Shegerian: OK.

Eva Kassens-Noor: That being said, I think it’s incrementally moving towards it. I think David’s interview before London was one of the really big steps forward to bring in carbon reductions. And the first thing you need to do is measure it. How bad is it? Then start incorporating how can we chip away from it and not just looking at the event in itself but rather the legacy. For example,, if you build a construction of course that has tremendous impact on the environment and on carbon emissions, so where do you start? That is kind of the big question.

John Shegerian: So from what you know now and what you do with regards to climate and sports and mega events, do you work with organizations like Dow and other large corporations on helping to green mega events, and then you also teach – at Michigan State – students on how to become the next leaders at these corporations, or what is actually – speak a little bit about your interrelationship on both the academia side and then also with regards to actually implementation.

Eva Kassens-Noor: I am by trade an urban planner, which means we do a lot of adaptive work.

John Shegerian: Right.

Eva Kassens-Noor: We like to work with communities. So from an academic standpoint, it is kind of the research that drives our implementation so we spend a lot of time working in our academic circles theorizing about what might be possible and then bringing that knowledge into practice and that is always the challenge with implementation.

John Shegerian: Got you.

Eva Kassens-Noor: And Dow was honestly the first corporation I have worked with or am starting to work with so I have not had that experience. For example, I have research grants with the Michigan Department of Transportation and new look at assessing transit agencies across Michigan. So these types of things we do, but it is more research grant approach versus with Dow it’s more “OK, let’s work together and go to these summits and move the agenda forward.”

John Shegerian: How are your big events and your arenas doing in Michigan? Are they already becoming green, or are you working with them to become greener or do they have a longer way to go?

Eva Kassens-Noor: They are starting to. I think Michigan State in particular has a really strong focus on sustainability so basically every email you probably get from Michigan State has the line “go green” so it’s really a large movement at the university.

John Shegerian: Right.

Eva Kassens-Noor: So the students are trying to then bring it out into the communities of Michigan. It’s kind of the trickledown effect that we do.

John Shegerian: Got you. When you see what’s going on here at the Green Sports Alliance, and also with regards to sports as a whole and this greening of sports, how do you feel in terms of big venues? How hard is it to manage carbon mitigation, and is it going to become a more and more specific profession for others to follow into and just work specifically on that?

Eva Kassens-Noor: I think it’s a tremendous challenge. The bigger the events are the more carbon emission you’ll have especially in terms of international travel – the transport pieces. So I look at it holistically.

John Shegerian: I see. From a macro perspective.

Eva Kassens-Noor: That’s right.

John Shegerian: I got you.

Eva Kassens-Noor: That’s right. Or thinking about even the trickle effect of complexity in understanding greenhouse gas emissions. So, for example, in Brazil, for the 2016 Olympics, they’re building a bus rapid transit line and the idea was to get cars off the road and have busses then on the road replacing them.

John Shegerian: Right.

Eva Kassens-Noor: Well, now, the moment you put in a bus rapid transit line you’re constructing it, you’re displacing residents and they then have to take the bus to come back in where previously they were walking. So it’s all these complexities, these trickledown effects that make it so hard to actually measure carbon.

John Shegerian: That’s fascinating. So you don’t get to look at it with sort of tunnel vision and just look at the finished product and say, “Oh, isn’t this nice; this is saving us all this carbon.” You look at it from – like you said – a holistic and macro perspective of everything that even had to happen for that to happen.

Eva Kassens-Noor: That’s right.

John Shegerian: Wow.

Eva Kassens-Noor: Or, for example, the moment you are driving these BRT lines through the Tijuca Forest, you had to deforest large parts, which then you are erasing a sink for carbon. So it’s really the big picture that we’re looking at.

John Shegerian: Got you. Any final thoughts? We’re down to the last two minutes. Any final thoughts for our listeners and viewers with regards to climate and sports and mega event planning?

Eva Kassens-Noor: I think what would be really important is understanding your own contribution to this.

John Shegerian: OK.

Eva Kassens-Noor: So every time you go to sports or cheer your children on at the small soccer game, think about how you get there and what it means if you would take public transport instead of your own car. So, basically, starting with oneself and trying to understand how much carbon am I emitting and is there a way by which I can reduce it?

John Shegerian: Got you. Those are great words and we thank you for joining us today. To learn more about the Green Sports Alliance, please go to www.GreenSportsAlliance.org. You have been listening to John Shegerian and Professor Eva Kassens-Noor talking about climate and sports and to find Eva, you can either go to Michigan State, and if you don’t want to go to Michigan State, you can go to www.MegaEventPlanning.org and find her there. You know, you’re making the world a better place. We are very thankful for that.

Eva Kassens-Noor: I am, too.

John Shegerian: And you are truly living proof that Green Is Good. Thank you so much for joining us Eva.

Eva Kassens-Noor: Thank you.